Midlife Uncensored
Midlife Uncensored-Real Life Discussions from Over the Hillis the no-holds-barred podcast you didn’t know you needed. Hosted by Joel Poppert, aka Poppy—the friendly Sasquatch with an epic beard—and his fiery co-host, Emanuela Messineo, aka E, this show unapologetically dives into the chaos, comedy, and WTF moments of midlife. If you’re 35-55 and ready to embrace the rollercoaster of aging, this podcast is your new home base.
Poppy and E tackle everything from modern dating disasters in the hilarious sub-series The Love Laugh Lounge (the “festivus” of dating) to real-life shit like divorce, mental breakdowns, balding, sagging tits, and figuring out how to parent while still figuring yourself out and maybe dealing with an unhinged ex. With a blend of interview episodes and no-expert-needed banter (except when we bring on experts), these two cut through the BS and get real about midlife—no filters, no sugarcoating, just pure, unfiltered truth with a heavy dose of humor. Expect raw, relatable stories, unfiltered guidance, tough love, easy happiness, and a few episodes where the comedy comes from alcohol infused banter, because who give a fuck, right?
Whether you’re dealing with the joys of aging, trying to keep your sanity while raising kids, or attempting to find love in a sea of idiots, Midlife Uncensored has your back. Expect a few F-bombs, some belly laughs, and a whole lot of honesty as Poppy and E rip the band-aid off midlife and give you permission to thrive in this beautifully messy chapter. It's not just about surviving midlife—it's about unfucking it and owning it! This is your community; we are in it together!
Midlife Uncensored
What Men and Women Need to Know About Each Other (But Never Learned) ft. Relationship Coach Justine Baruch
In Episode 44 of Midlife Uncensored, Poppy and E welcome back relationship coach and therapist Justine Baruch for an unfiltered and insightful discussion on relationships, dating, and personal growth. With nearly 20 years of experience helping individuals and couples navigate the complexities of love, communication, and emotional well-being, Justine dives deep into the tools and strategies that can heal, enhance, and transform relationships.
From understanding the biological differences between men and women in stress and communication to unpacking the magic of connection through appreciation and curiosity, this episode offers something for everyone—whether you're single, dating, happily coupled, or in the trenches of relationship struggles.
Highlights include:
- The difference between how men and women process emotions (and why it matters).
- The importance of creating your five non-negotiables for relationships.
- How to reignite passion and intimacy in long-term relationships.
- Why therapy and coaching must work hand-in-hand for true transformation.
- Justine’s “Second Floor Effect” metaphor for navigating conflict.
There’s laughter, wine, and even a little spice as the trio tackle the joys and challenges of midlife relationships with honesty and humor. Don’t miss this episode if you’re ready to level up your personal connections and discover actionable tips for building better relationships.
Be sure to follow us on Instagram (@midlifeuncensored) to share your thoughts, send in your five non-negotiables, and stay up to date on upcoming episodes and events! 🎙️
About Justine:
Justine is a Life and Relationship Coach, now based out of Colorado. With over 20 years of experience, and having coached 1,000's of people, she helps enhance every relationship, including the one with yourself! She can be found on Instagram @justinebaruch and you can engage with her, find her master classes and see what she is up to at her website via this link.
How to Engage with Us
- DM us on Instagram midlifeuncensored
- Follow Joel on IG jpoppert
- Follow Emanuela on IG emanuela5683 or accountability_with_e
Thanks for joining the Owning Alone community, I certainly appreciate you!
All right, all right, all right. Welcome to another episode of Midlife Uncensored. This is your host, poppy, your favorite friendly Sasquatch with the epic beard game, and to my right is my lovely co-host, emanuela Messinaio, also known as E. Before we get started, remember to subscribe. We're on the Instagram, the gram at Midlife Uncensored. You can also find us by default on Facebook, and remember to subscribe and reach out. We want to hear from you guys. Download all our episodes, rate us five stars, four stars, but if you want to rate us three stars, don't rate us at all. Make some comments, tell your friends we're doing good things here and we love you all, so let's jump in. So welcome to episode 44 of the Midlife Uncensored podcast. Today we are blessed to have Justine Baruch. Did I pronounce that right? She's laughing because I tried five times.
Speaker 2:No, he screwed it up again. She's going to correct me. He's good If you recognize that name.
Speaker 1:Stop laughing at me If you recognize that name. Yes, she's been on the podcast before. She did an early version of the Love Laugh Lounge. If you remember correctly, she spent a very significant time overseas and is back in America in her hometown living the Colorado life again, getting back into dating. But the reason that we brought Justine on not just because we enjoy talking to her is she has spent nearly 20 years in relationship coaching therapy, helping single people and people in relationships figure out that whole part of their lives. So welcome to the podcast. E, it's great to see you. I'm terrible, but I like to let my guests tell me a little bit about themselves and their bios, because I forget shit and pronounce names wrong. So welcome to the show again.
Speaker 3:I'll take it over from here. You did a great job. You got the name pretty good. So I've been working in the realm of relationships for almost 20 years. For over a decade I used to run workshops and retreats on sexuality and relationships, so I've got a lot of good tools on my tool belt for that to keep things juicy and spicy. And then, when the beloved COVID happened, I moved everything online and I started doing more couples coaching at that point, and so I still have my group programs. They're no longer in person, but I have online. I have one for men, one for women, which I'm going to run live once more, and then they're done.
Speaker 1:But don't feel free to plug yourself. I know you're selling your packages right now at a discount. Isn't there a Black Friday deal?
Speaker 3:Yeah, but Black Friday's gone, done, but there will be, but they're still for sale. Yeah, now you get to pay full price.
Speaker 3:Now you get to pay full price. But no, I have a men's program and a women's program which I imagine I'll reference some things on that there. But they're helping people to understand the differences between men and women. But it's not just that it understand the differences between men and women, but it's not just that. It's not just about relationship stuff, because in order to be in a relationship, you got to be healthy within yourself.
Speaker 3:You got to know yourself and understand yourself, know how to manage your emotions, know how to manage other people's emotions, communication, so all of that's in there as well. So it really helps people who are single and in relationship and coming out of it. People are like, oh my God, my relationship with my father is healed because I understand him in a whole new way. Or I relate better to my roommate, my grandma and my aunt and my cousin, because they're all women and I never understood all of this stuff.
Speaker 2:So how long is your program? Can you tell me more about it?
Speaker 1:Actually, I do want to just give you a quick plug here, because when we were eating before I had met, made the comment that, uh, in the like 20 minutes that we had talked, you had given me more insight than, like a lot of couples counseling that I did during my marriage. So kudos to you. So it's probably worth the money to go, sorry.
Speaker 2:I'm genuinely curious, though, like you've talked about it. So, yeah, tell me more Like how long is it, how does it?
Speaker 3:Well, they're generally six weeks, there's six modules, but I I sometimes put an extra week or two in there so people can catch up because there's a lot of material in there. It's different for men and women. Like I first created the women's program where, you know, the first one was all about how we in that, the first module is all about how we emasculate them because we just there's so many frustrations we, yeah, we emasculate them because we just there's so many frustrations.
Speaker 3:We yeah, we emasculate men because women have so many frustrations in with men and we don't realize that we are actually causing the very things that we are complaining about. They don't communicate and we don't realize the ways in which we are shutting men down. They aren't supportive towards our emotions and we don't realize the ways in which we're not setting them up for success because we don't know how to articulate it to a man and his man brain or the communication stuff. So, yeah, there's just a lot that's there. So I break that down, I go into sexuality, I go into communication, I go into the different ways that we connect outside of love languages, and so again, it's a lot of.
Speaker 3:I've had women come through it who can be pretty chaotic in their emotions and there was one woman whose relationship was ending because of that or on pause until she finished the program. She learned such a healthier way and healed herself because she was projecting so much of her not good enough onto her partner and trying to get the validation that she needed to give to herself from him and when she could see those wounds and heal those wounds like the work that I do so much of couples. Therapy also deals with the symptoms rather than getting to the core of what's actually going on. So when I work with people, I'm going to go to the core of it and deal with that, and then the symptoms take care of themselves. And after I created the women's program, I'm all about like not wanting to emasculate men, but now I just gave women this wealth of knowledge and now they get to go tell their men, here's how you have to behave. And I'm like, oh my God, I'm creating the very problem trying to solve.
Speaker 3:So, I created a men's program and I thought I was just going to flip it around and be like, okay, well, here's the men's stuff and I'm going to just say the same thing talking to men. And as I created it, I was like, oh my god, no, men need to know different stuff and I need.
Speaker 1:Men really are. What is it? Men are from venus, women are from mars, men are from mars. We're from mars, you're from mars, I'm from venus I thought men were were from Venus because we had a penis. But oh.
Speaker 3:I've never heard of that, but I did do my original coaching training under John Gray, who wrote that book. I think his books are great. Yeah, there's a lot of really good stuff in there. I've read many of them. There's like 36 of them.
Speaker 2:So who do you recommend does that? So wait, let's back up a second. So that pro? So wait, let's back up a second. So you have this men and women's like coaching, six week coaching opportunity. What else do you have? And I guess also, who do you recommend goes through that? And then, what else do you offer too, in addition?
Speaker 3:to anybody who's in a heterosexual relationship I think would greatly benefit from these programs. I had one woman go through. She's like justine there would be no divorce if people everybody went through your programs and I was like I don't know if I agree with that because I think some people should get divorced. I worked for a 13-year relationship and we ended with so much love. We're best friends, but we're not meant to spend our lives together, or maybe if they ended they would end in a healthy way.
Speaker 2:They end in a healthy way for sure, Rather than people hanging on for the wrong reasons or going through that cycle of awful yeah yeah.
Speaker 1:Which is so important for recovery, too, from a relationship. Yeah, you can do it amicably.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, yeah, I agree with that. So I have people who are in a good relationship and they want to make it great.
Speaker 3:I have people who broke up right before and then they ended up getting back together during or after. I have people who were on the rocks and then they mended the relationship. I had people who went through it. They broke up months before the program and then they ended up getting back with their person afterwards because they're like, oh I see all the ways that I fucked up, let me do this better, let me go and apologize and make an amends. And I've also had a lot of single people go through and then afterwards like they felt like they healed their relationship with men or women, masculine or feminine, and they shifted the thing so that they could attract a healthy relationship.
Speaker 3:And so I've had some really beautiful emails there where it's like Justine, I got a guy. That's awesome.
Speaker 1:Would you recommend it for people that are dating to get more perspective?
Speaker 3:on. Oh for sure, my I what I learned. Should it be a? Netflix special this is where I think it should be going.
Speaker 1:Yes, everybody needs to learn how to be in healthy relationships, including myself.
Speaker 3:Yes, yeah, because there's a lot of just understanding yourself. And also, at the very beginning, I have this ideal relationship masterclass and I'm just going to throw out some exercises that people can do there, that we do in that masterclass. But, like, I have people write down their ideal man, their ideal woman and you know women have a much longer list quite often but then what's important is, like I work with that and I go okay, now take each point and I want you to look at are you the kind of person that is going to match that and where are you not and how can you do it better? Because so often we look on the outside this is how I want you to be, but we sometimes fail to look at am I matching that? I want somebody who, like, wakes up and is productive and not a procrastinator, and, like, makes the most out of the day.
Speaker 3:What are my morning routines? Like, where am I procrastinating in my life? Like, how am I showing up? How do I handle myself when I'm angry? Do I withdraw? Do I explode? And so when you look at that list, the focus should be how am I doing on each of these qualities? So we have that and then we pair people up and we have them do some reflective exercises.
Speaker 3:Also the five non-negotiable which we talked about beforehand which is like what are the five things that your partner must have in order for you to want to be in a fulfilling relationship? Like that is going to just like really light you up and that is such a good exercise to get in touch with, Cause you can only have five, cannot have six, you got to have five.
Speaker 2:Five sounds good and I mean we could do an entire I would love to do that, I think I think we need to do that for sure it comes up so much with.
Speaker 2:I feel like so many people in our age group are either discovering that or, you know, just kind of learning about it, and I think it's so important even like going into a dating situation, you can tell when people don't have awareness around it, like what they're non-negotiable, like what they're looking for, where they're going, that kind of thing. So I think that would be a really good episode for us to do in the future.
Speaker 3:That'd be fun If we could give the audience some homework and send in their five non-negotiables beforehand, so we could like give some samples.
Speaker 1:Look at you, yes including the host, including, yeah, and if you don't know, we're popping, yeah if you don't know, yeah, and we did decide that they can't be not haves it's very important because your subconscious doesn't understand negatives.
Speaker 3:And this is really I mean, I would say this is a huge tip for people in relationships to communicate, not just relationships If you've got kids, whatever you're doing, if you're a boss, like, always communicate what you want and not what you don't want, and our brain, for the most part, by default, will communicate what we don't want. So you see your kids and you're like don't drop that. Or you're telling your partner they're going to go to the store, don't forget to pick up the almond milk. So we're constantly saying dotes and we're focusing on the negative. And we're communicating the negative because our reptilian brain is focused on survival, so it's looking for danger. It's just the way it orients. If you can shift your language to saying what you want, your whole ability to manifest and to communicate in a way that's not going to trigger defensiveness significantly changes. Yeah, I love that.
Speaker 2:Okay, so if we're giving people homework, it has to be positive. So no negative, like don't be negative about it. Five total no more than five. Can you have three? Go five go five okay five, five, five is the magic number if you can't come up with five, I'm just saying I'm just asking questions.
Speaker 2:I'm not saying you, I'm just saying I've I've come up with five, don't you worry. What are the other, like rules, what are the other parameters for you? I I asked you earlier and I said how do you know if you, if you don't know, what your non-negotiables are, what's like a good question or thing to pay attention to when you're trying to discover them?
Speaker 3:So two things. One, look for what lights you up. Okay, like what? What's made you really excited. So one of my non-negotiables is somebody who's got a very extensive book collection, whether it's Kindle or it's a bookshelf or it's Audible, somebody who has personal development books. Like when I see that in a guy and I'm like you're going to have some good conversations, and conversations are what lights me up, and conversations about books really light me up. And how did you discover that? By dating and seeing guys' bookshelves and getting really excited.
Speaker 2:I was like or whack the rough maybe or like, but no, they're actually.
Speaker 3:I noticed this became one because I was having a conversation with a guy we had been on one date and he made a comment. I made a comment back and he was like, well, that's not what this book says, and he sent me a picture of it and it was she comes first or something. I was like, well, and it was she Comes First or something. I was like wow, I have opinions about that book. I taught about sex for over a decade. I've definitely got opinions about that book.
Speaker 3:And you're being educated by that book and we might be going somewhere. So I need to express my opinions here. But I also got to see all the books to the left and the right and I was like you just became so much more interesting. And I watched the response that I had upon seeing that picture of his bookshelf and I was like, oh, that's a non-negotiable. That lights me up a lot.
Speaker 2:Yeah, okay, yeah, so that's a good example of just something to. I mean, I feel like that's just such a great story to share, because we can all evolve over time too, like can non-negotiables change too, online changed they were.
Speaker 3:They were different three, four months ago, and then I made them a lot more personal and quirky.
Speaker 1:I love it.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I got to think about that.
Speaker 3:And what?
Speaker 2:what was there?
Speaker 3:The other one is like, since I said, a lot of us focus on the negative, yeah, so if you can focus on your last relationship, relationship or relationships, what didn't work, get a piece of paper, draw a line down the middle and put all of the shit that you didn't like on the left-hand side and then find the things that were the biggest, circle them and then what is the opposite side of that?
Speaker 3:So what would the positive of that be? Yeah, and not that you can use that trick for anything in life. If you're trying to figure out what you want to manifest in your life, a lot of times people know what they don't know, and that's equally valuable information, but don't focus on what you don't want shifted around. Yeah, fill out the right hand.
Speaker 1:I think it'd be. I think I should probably do this like tomorrow. I have nothing scheduled for tomorrow Cause I keep dating like a fucking I for tomorrow after work because I keep dating like a fucking.
Speaker 2:I don't know what the right word is. I'm just like don't, don't do it, don't do it, what don't?
Speaker 1:cock block yourself. I'm not cock blocking myself do it, don't do it tomorrow.
Speaker 3:He is getting clear and intentional and, just like you're gonna want a man who's got a plan clearly one of my non-negotiables is attractive women, so I think, after I show you this video later, I'm gonna post this on instagram your non-negotiables is attractive women, I think.
Speaker 2:after I show you this video later, I'm going to post this on. Instagram. Your non-negotiable is going to be she needs to know how to churn butter.
Speaker 1:Churn butter. She's going to cook and clean.
Speaker 2:Wait till you guys see this. Our friend Alex came over last night and I showed him this video and our cheeks were hurting. We were laughing so hard at this. It's pretty funny. If I could if I could, like play it on the podcast, we would do it's hysterical I do have one non-negotiable and I don't know how to articulate it.
Speaker 1:We can talk about it after. We can talk about it on the thing. But I recently dated this girl from chicago and one of the in people the Midwest, or particularly from Chicago or the cities of Minneapolis. They have this like really fun light, you know, non-political edge to them, right, not in terms of politics, but just like we can have the funnest conversations because I don't have to worry about, we don't have to worry about what's said, it's all, it can all be said and all of it's fair game. And just like I'm that kind of person, like I don't don't operate in silos of other populist opinions, right, so we, so we just like we had the best.
Speaker 1:We would talk like for hours and hours and laugh and talk about this and make raunchy jokes and blah, blah, blah. And I don't know how to articulate that non-negotiable. But I find that's important for me to be able to just to. Just because I'm very well read, I think about a lot of things and I want to just talk about stuff in different layers and blah, blah. But like it was just this really fun way to how about witty banter?
Speaker 3:yeah, is that it she's got to be able to do witty banter witty banter.
Speaker 2:I said open-minded banter. That was what I wrote down it's close it's.
Speaker 1:It's deeper than that, though, I think, because it's really hard to find here yeah, well, let's let I mean this.
Speaker 3:So let's start, everybody do the girl I went with last night.
Speaker 1:She was from madison and she had the same thing. We just sat there and chatted for like an hour and a half about we just I guess I just felt free to talk and I'm not like a bad person. It's not like bad things come out of my mouth, I just feel like I don't know there's. I'm going to figure it out. So I'm going to spend Friday afternoon figuring out which, what, what that one is.
Speaker 3:Non-negotiables. So let's do this. Everybody who's listening, send in your non-negotiables.
Speaker 2:Once we get at least 10.
Speaker 1:Yeah, send us your non-negotiables we got five, only five.
Speaker 2:10 of you send us your five non-negotiables.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and then I can tell you all of the ways that I use this when I coach people in dating and in relationships and I've got great stories around you know, somebody deciding if this is a relationship that fits for them, or how anxious, attached use this, or how dismissive, avoided uses. So, guys, do your homework, love it.
Speaker 2:Okay, I'm really hot. Can I take off my shirt? Yeah, also, I couldn't. We're not editing that out.
Speaker 1:I'm really hot too. Can I take my pants off? I can open the door. I was hot too, but I thought my pants off. We have two attractive women.
Speaker 2:I can open the door. I was hot too, but I thought it was because I ate all those jalapenos.
Speaker 3:I'm very hot over here. You can Go ahead. It's like a lacy bra. Are you okay with that, I don't care.
Speaker 2:I'm hot too I'm wearing a sweatshirt. Okay.
Speaker 1:Oh, my God. I freaking love this, you should definitely not, I just wore my nice t-shirt today.
Speaker 3:We all just took off a layer of clothes.
Speaker 2:I love it. This is amazing.
Speaker 1:I'm not taking mine off because I don't have, you don't have anything underneath it.
Speaker 2:I mean I have a bra on, but it's like yeah. That's what I got here but we're good, I have like tights on. That's awkward, joel.
Speaker 1:Joel, you want me to turn your volume down now it's getting hot, look at it's getting hot in here oh my gosh, this is hysterical.
Speaker 1:It's like strip poker, strip podcast that could be my ears this brings me to my the new yoga classes I've been taking lately sorry oh, you're gonna turn the mic off now yeah, because my, I just realized my ears so I started taking yoga classes recently and I don't really know what to wear. Started taking yoga classes recently and I don't really know what to wear. I've been told basketball shorts are not really kosher, but I've been wearing code. I've been wearing basketball shorts and uh t-shirts are you hanging out of them? No, I wear underwear okay, then that's I. I ordered yoga shorts. They should be at my house actually what are yoga shorts?
Speaker 2:they basically have a liner in them. Oh okay, yeah, I thought they were just spandex shorts. Oh my god, could you imagine joel showing up to yoga? And speed, just speedos and my jean jacket I went to a. Yeah, your jean jacket, which I've been wearing religiously since you left at my house like four months cropped, isn't it cropped too, it cropped like shorter I you know.
Speaker 3:I don't know because I the first time I ever wore it was to his house oh, shut up I think you left a cup there too.
Speaker 1:Now that I think about it, yeah, she did a wine club I brought my own wine cup you brought your own wine cup to my party.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I don. I don't think I would. I'm not that kind of woman.
Speaker 1:I think you did.
Speaker 2:Or it was someone else's. If you're missing a, a special wine cup One of those. It's like one of the like Yeti type, like it has a lid. It's like one of the insulated wine cups.
Speaker 3:Not me, but I'll take it. Yeah, you can have it, my cupboard's full.
Speaker 1:Okay, what are we doing now? Relationships Relationships.
Speaker 3:All right, pick a topic. Do you want me to throw some out and you can pick one?
Speaker 1:I guess I think what I was going to ask is going back to you. Have almost 20 years of experience talking to people. I assume relationships and dynamics around relationships have evolved somewhat as we've evolved as human beings, but I imagine a good chunk of it hasn't so. Like, what are the common? I guess what are the common themes whatever themes you want to pick that are that are that relationships suffer from or benefit from, I guess whatever.
Speaker 2:Okay, just tell us about relationships.
Speaker 3:Okay, I'm going to, I'm going to give a, I'm going to give a quick answer where I cover a lot of things and then you pick which one you want to go deeper into, okay, okay.
Speaker 3:So things that I see struggling in relationship, especially where there's kids, is time, how to mix time and space for the relationship and for connection, and too many people will prioritize their kids, and you need to prioritize your relationship because you are making an imprint on your kids for the quality of relationship that is possible and we talked about that before too just like what our parents have done for us, I am blessed to have parents that are still married and in love and they're amazing. They're 44 years and they're just so cute most of the time and when they're not, they're just like they're. You know, we all have our relationships, so no relationship is perfect. So the importance of prioritizing your relationship and not and making space for that. Another one is losing the spark and losing the passion, and that's one that you want to catch before it becomes a pattern, and so how to bring that spark back, how to bring that passion back, how to prioritize intimacy and I got a lot to say around that and I got a lot of tricks around that, I would say.
Speaker 3:Another one is managing stress. So it's really important to understand how you manage stress and how your partner manages stress and how to help each other in that, because what a man's body needs to regulate stress and what a woman's body needs to regulate stress is different and sometimes we try to do or help or advise the other based on what works for us and we are just not wired the same. There's a 1% difference in our brains and this is a general difference. It's not applying to everybody, but overall there's a 1% difference between a man's brain and a woman's brain and that 1% has a huge difference in how we show up in life, stress, emotions and communication. We also process emotions differently. That's why women are always bitching about how men try to fix the problem and men are bitching about how women talk too much and complain too much and why does she need to talk about it or whatever.
Speaker 3:And true story true story, but there's a biological explanation behind it, and when I bring that into my couples or my courses, people are like oh.
Speaker 3:I get it. And then they show up better, with more patience, with more understanding, with more support. So the emotions is one, and then there's communication, and there's so much to say around how the masculine communicates and how the feminine communicates, and we don't even really need to break it down to that, because sometimes all of this is switched the other way around. So, just understanding your way and the other person's way, so that you can stop judging it, you can stop getting frustrated by it, you can stop misinterpreting it and making it mean something that it doesn't, because they're different. If you were to act that way, it would mean that, but they are different, and when you understand the differences, then you can work with them instead of getting worked by them. So that's the answer to my.
Speaker 3:My answer to your first question about, like, what are the problems that I'm seeing? What are the things that help? I would was oh, I'm going to just say this off the cuff and maybe I'll think about it later and have a different answer but express appreciation. If you can start doing one thing in your relationship, express an appreciation every single day. When I give this to a couple and I'm like, for the next three weeks, you have to express one appreciation, and it's going to be different every single day, and even though it's an assignment, it still starts to change because you look for it, yeah, and then you're looking for the good instead of the bad, which?
Speaker 1:there's something there changes your psyche, it changes your psyche.
Speaker 3:It changes your reticular activating system, like it's looking for a certain thing and it wants to validate that.
Speaker 3:It's true, but if you shift what you're looking for and there there's also this thing that I call the second floor flooding or the second floor effect so it's like all of the good memories are on the first floor, everything you like about your partner is on the first floor, and sometimes it gets flooded and you have to run to the second floor and that's where all of the negative memories are, and like all of their flaws, and you're stuck on the second floor and that's all you can see.
Speaker 3:And so there's times where, in my relationship, I would be like we'd be having a fight and I'm like hon, I'm on the second floor right now, cause in that moment all I can see is like death and destruction of the relationship, like he sucks and this sucks and we're never going to be out of you know. But I know I understand the brain, so I know that I'm just stuck on the second floor, my RAS isn't a certain thing right now, and he'll be like I am too, and I'm like okay, are we going to shift this now, or do we want to like take a breather and come back until we get to, like, get access to the first floor. At least. Stand on the stairwell and go like there's a floor down there. Do you want to walk onto it or not?
Speaker 1:So yeah, I would say appreciation, it's very interesting to have those sort of tools in your toolbox.
Speaker 3:People have called my toolbox the Mary Poppins bag of personal development. I've got 20 years and I have an addiction to learning, so I have actually limits on myself to one to three courses at a time.
Speaker 2:Oh my God, I love it. That's amazing. I like that visual too. That's like a, really I like that.
Speaker 3:The second floor.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's amazing. I like that visual too. That's like a really.
Speaker 3:I like that. The second floor, yeah, it's so helpful. It's a good one.
Speaker 1:It's so helpful and just being able to name it, and you know that it's a condition of the brain.
Speaker 2:Well, you can get stuck on the second floor.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, I think also if you both or one person can get stuck on it and the other person's like why are you up there? I'm down here. I remember all the good stuff.
Speaker 2:I don't have any access to the good stuff. Well, and if you both have the same vocabulary around, that it also, I feel like it makes it more tangible. So then, when you're kind of stuck in that mode, it's not necessarily about the other person mode, it's not necessarily about the other person. Like, if you're kind of making it something a little bit more tangible, it's like you're not accused, you're not throwing an accusation, like right now all I can see is all the negative things about you, right. Like instead you're like I'm stuck on the second floor, right.
Speaker 2:It's not like you're not, I don't know. I feel like it just depolarizes like that conversation around it. So I really enjoy that. That's.
Speaker 3:that's awesome, I like how you reflected that back to it, and it is helpful to have these kinds of imagery and these tools, and this is something that I love, that I love about my I love going through my own courses Cause I'm like I need reminders you know, sometimes I suck, and it's so helpful when we have an understanding and a context and then it's shared, which is why I said I needed to create a course for the men, because if I created a course for the women to keep telling them then what to do, which is kind of a problem.
Speaker 1:That's usually where it starts.
Speaker 2:I know Okay. So if you put this, okay you putting the material out there for women, obviously you have the context of being a woman, Like how have men given you feedback on the material that?
Speaker 3:you've put together for them. So I'm so glad you asked that question when I was going through it, because I there are so many therapists out there that are women and this is especially when it comes to emotions that they're telling men how to here's how you need to handle your emotions. There are mothers and wives and women therapists and I, when I was going through, and I created a whole module around emotions for men so that they could better understand their own and women's, and I needed to really drop in and do some research on this, not just like book research, which I'm a bookworm, but also market research, talking to men and really understanding this, because I did not want to teach from my own blind spots as being a woman. Sure, and what happens is like we've got two centers in our brain where we process emotions. Can I get a little geeky? Yeah, okay. So we've got two centers in our brains where we process emotions. We have the MMS and the TPJ, the mirror neuron system and the temporal product.
Speaker 3:And when you say we all of us, all of us. Okay Now, we women mostly use the MMS and men mostly use the TPJ. So the MMS is like we feel our emotions, there's a lot of empathy and the TPJ is analyzing. So men will feel their emotions for a moment and then they're going to switch over to the TPJ. So men usually process their emotions by analyzing them. So that's why when we're emotional, they start to analyze it and they try to fix it, because that's what works for them. That's why you guys feel better.
Speaker 3:But we need to feel our emotions and when our cortisol levels are up, when we are emotional, what brings our emotions down, what brings our cortisol down, sorry, is when the oxytocin goes up. Oxytocin goes up when we get to talk about our emotions and we feel seen and heard in them. So, with understanding that, like if I tell men you just got to hold a trash can, so here's another visual for you Hold the trash can and she's got to get all of these words out and you do not want to interrupt that process, your solution is not going to bring down her cortisol. She needs to get the words out that is going to increase her oxytocin, which will bring down the cortisol so you can bring your solution in after she has gotten everything out and you'll notice because she starts to speak slower and so you start to like measure where her cortisol levels are.
Speaker 2:Let her fill the trash can Let her fill the trash can with the words oh, I like it, I like it.
Speaker 1:I'm just envisioning like my arms are so tired. I can't hold this in anymore. It's gonna fall, honey.
Speaker 2:Are you done? You also don't have to hold it. It can be on the ground, you just have to hold it.
Speaker 1:I want to build like a tool now to hold the trash. Can I've got tips for that?
Speaker 3:I want to build like a tool now to hold the trash can, yes, but like you, I've got tips for that. I've got tips.
Speaker 1:Like a lever that makes it easier.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:But you need to watch the level. Wait till it's full, then take the bag out.
Speaker 3:But for the men, like men, women are always like talk about it, you're going to feel better. No, ladies, they're not. Because when he talks about it, his estrogen levels are going to go up and what he needs to bring his cortisol down is testosterone, and so when he's in the heat of an emotion, he needs to take space, and so that's why men will sometimes just walk away and they're like he's just walking away now. Ideally, guys, you say hey, right now I'm not able to show up as the kind of man I want to, so I'm going to take some space right now, articulate it, set some expectations that you're going to go somewhere. So hopefully she doesn't follow you, because if she's anxious, attached and she's a woman, she's probably going to follow you and violate your boundaries. And you know women don't realize that that's a boundary violation. They think we, think we're trying to solve the problem and keep connection.
Speaker 3:Whole, nother topic. But in helping men to understand and process their emotions, it's okay to think about it, and men get judged all the time for being mental and and like analyzing things. But I'm like but do you need to understand the brain?
Speaker 2:Well, and if we go back to your point, so many yeah Do you want to write. Well I you don't need to slow clap, you can fast clap, Loud clap.
Speaker 1:No, it would be too much of a snob to somebody Yay.
Speaker 2:The other thing I was going to say is, if you started to, you were talking about so many female therapists out there counseling men and that I imagine if they don't have awareness or haven't done sort of the research into the male brain and psyche that you have, that it probably makes men feel very invalidated, unheard when they're going to a therapist trying to actually do some good and then they're like being told to do something that isn't actually beneficial or natural for them to actually solve the like, whatever that crisis is, that they're in, so they feel wrong or they try to do something that doesn't actually work for them, and then I'm broken.
Speaker 3:I can't make this work. It's even worse.
Speaker 2:It makes it like I feel like I feel like just the stigma around therapy, especially for men, is already so difficult that, if you can get them through the door, the last thing you want to do is have a bad experience in there for them.
Speaker 1:I think when you explain science too. It's interesting A couple of things you said. One is the therapy world is dominated by women, and this is true. There are are male therapists, but there's a lot of female therapists. It's the same thing with like teaching and certain professions and the science.
Speaker 1:Like you know, we've been now talking between the podcast and dinner for about an hour and a half and my eyes are much wider open. I'm and and I'm sitting here thinking like why, why don't particularly couples, therapists, start with the science? And then because from a male perspective, it's like, oh wow, it's not like a gotcha, like now I know why and I'm going to use it against you it's like it makes much more sense now to me as a male, because you told me the science of it. I guess where my real question is is like now, tell us about the initial. Let's say, you've got your couples or whatever the relation, the couples that you get that are high tension, right like you catch them at their either the end or at the beginning of the end, and how much friction is there when you start talking to the science. Is it like a oh my god it's.
Speaker 3:It's usually an oh my god. And to go back to your, question.
Speaker 1:Nobody's told like just I'm sorry, nobody's ever told me this, and this has been a reoccurring problem in relationships I've had. And I don't know, because maybe I'm an, I'm an, I'm an extreme person and on the side of the male side of like because I am the person that's like I don't know, because maybe I'm an, I'm an, I'm an extreme person and on the side of the male side of like because I am the person that's like I don't.
Speaker 3:I do not want to talk about this during the height of of us fighting and I usually incite the guys that want to talk about it in the height of it are usually anxious attached there of the attachment style theory, which is phenomenal. If you haven't studied attachment style theory and you want to figure out some shit in your relationship, go study that. It's really good.
Speaker 1:I did read Attached.
Speaker 3:It's not my favorite book on attachment style theory.
Speaker 1:A big fan of Jessica Baum.
Speaker 3:It's a starting point. It's a starting point.
Speaker 1:And it is like the most popular book on it, but it's not my favorite.
Speaker 3:But to go back to your question. But to go back to your question, how do men feel so, so many men, that I coach a lot of guys where I'm their first experience of therapy?
Speaker 3:Sometimes so lucky and I also coach a lot of alpha males, like a lot of my clients are, are CEOs or they're business leaders or whatever, whatever. And they'll be like, oh, I feel so understood. Like you know, I have these very macho men and they'll be like she just really gets me, she understands me. And then one of the guys who went through my course, it's like it's so much better to learn about women from a woman and not a dude.
Speaker 2:But also a woman who understands men.
Speaker 3:Oh, I understand and I love men.
Speaker 2:Like that's the thing that's that's so beautiful.
Speaker 3:And I noticed in my dating sometimes guys are hard on guys and I'm like so beautiful, and I noticed in my dating, sometimes guys are hard on guys and I'm like, wow, you've got some really negative opinion about men and I'll start advocating for men with a guy that I'm dating. But this is also something that a woman she said you know your work works because you are an advocate for women and for men. And now I also piss. If you guys come to me for couples coaching, like I sometimes piss you off because I will hold you accountable, like what is the thing that you need to look at. And sometimes that's really frustrating because we really want to blame the other person.
Speaker 3:But if you stay focused on the other person, you are a victim because you cannot change them. You can only change you. So what is it that in you that you can, that you can shift here? And there is a lot, even if it's just 2%, there's a lot you can do within your 2%. You have brought this person into your life to learn something and change something. So figure out what that is and change it. And if they don't change with you, then you at least changed, changed your resonance that brought that person into your life right. So when you leave the relationship, you're going to attract a different quality of person. So no, no time is lost.
Speaker 2:We all bring something to the the equation, right, so I I I've fallen into this in the past and I definitely avoid it now, but that whole like victim mentality of like, oh, they're doing this to me. I mean, I'm I'm a recovering people pleaser, so, like falling into that victim mode used to be very easy to do, because it was like, oh, I don't know, it was just a different. You know, I wasn't as aware of other things, whatever, so you know over time, I guess I think what you're saying. What I heard you say, though, is like we all are bringing portion of like. What I brought to this equation is I attracted something that wasn't working for me, and I have to fix that so I attract something higher quality or better for me in the future?
Speaker 3:Yeah, and if you want to go deeper into that, the book Getting the Love you Want is fantastic for that.
Speaker 3:Okay, yeah. And then to go back to your question about people who have come to me who have been like on, I had one couple that had been married 32 years and I was their last hope. They're like if this doesn't work with you, then we're done, and so no pressure. You guys got here but now I that couple within, I would say, within six weeks, and I give homework, like I only do six-month coaching containers for the most part. A few times I'll make exceptions out of that, because it's not just about the sessions, it's about what happens in between the sessions. So I'm all about the integration.
Speaker 3:I gave them homework. Now these guys I give them homework. And they come to the next session and they're like sorry, we didn't do our homework because we sat down, we made the space and then we just kept having sex. Oh, and I was like oh, my God, you guys have been married 32 years, you have three kids, you're on the verge of divorce, we're six weeks into this container and you can't keep your hands off of each other and that's okay.
Speaker 2:That is a good excuse to do the homework.
Speaker 3:Oh the homework? No, the homework was not. I mean, I do give homework, was not? Oh, okay, I definitely do that, but that was not their homework. They had some emotional processing to do, oh so they were procrastinating.
Speaker 2:They're like let's just skip to the fun part.
Speaker 3:And I and I was in such support of that because I had been missing, because they had felt disconnected. So the fact that they felt so connected that they couldn't keep their hands off of each other I celebrated that and gave an extension to the homework Okay, extension to the homework, not a dismissal or an excused absence. I'll take that excuse.
Speaker 2:I love it yeah.
Speaker 3:That's awesome. So, yeah, sometimes it goes really good and sometimes you might realize, hey, we're not meant to be together, but to acknowledge that with a whole lot of love and gratitude and celebrate what you did have.
Speaker 1:Sure yeah.
Speaker 2:Are you? Do you? Okay? So are. Are most of the people that you coach local, virtual. All combined, what?
Speaker 3:are they all over the world?
Speaker 2:All over the world, yeah.
Speaker 3:I lived abroad for 20 years, so I know that's why it was yeah.
Speaker 2:I was just curious, though If people want to access you, they can do it from anywhere. Yeah, all virtual I mean I do some.
Speaker 3:I normally the people that fly in to see me usually do like a I. One of my offers is like a breakthrough intensive, which is a 10 hour breakthrough session over one or two days, but that's where I do in person and I do that online as well. It's so it could go either way, but a lot of couple stuff is online.
Speaker 2:Okay, that's awesome. I had a question about sex. I got a lot to say about this topic. It wouldn't be a good podcast without sex.
Speaker 1:So I think my question was around. There's always this sort of stigma around how men, how sex, plays the role in the relationship for men and women.
Speaker 3:I'm so excited to answer this. So, please, yes, go.
Speaker 1:You know what I'm trying to ask.
Speaker 3:I do, I have an entire. I have no, I have an entire masterclass on this. So if you want to hear an extended version of this, then you can go get that, but this is also a class that I have in my courses as well, we'll make sure we put all this stuff on the description.
Speaker 3:And so I'm going to say this and I'm going to speak about it in regards to the masculine and feminine, and I, at some point, I have the intention of like coming up with the names of like tree and Bush. So it's not gender specific, because sometimes it's the other way around. So listen to what I'm going to speak about, about the two different temperaments, and if you are a woman and you fit more to the masculine which I have dealt with, couples like that then just understand that that that's how you are and you probably attracted the opposite. But for lack of me not getting to that part yet within my own brain, then I'm going to speak about this in regards to masculine and feminine.
Speaker 3:So the masculine connects through sex and the feminine connects through communication. So we've got the love languages. That's great, that works. And then we've got this and they can. You know, two different models of how to connect.
Speaker 3:And so the masculine connects through sex says that sex can open a man up to his heart. It opens a man up to his feelings. When he's well fucked, then he's going to be more open and motivated to communicate and to do other things, and if he's not, then he's not going to want to do those things. Now the other way around when a woman connects through communication, she's going to be more willing to have sex. So some women are like he hasn't talked to me all week, and then he comes home on the weekend or he comes home at night and he wants to fuck and I do not want to do that and he's trying to connect. I can go through so many different analogies, and I do in my masterclass, where I break this down, because this concept, when you get this and understand this, it helps so much. So take it's like late at night and you know the woman is too tired for sex, but she is all for all available for a good conversation, or a guy is too tired for a good?
Speaker 1:conversation. The guy said there are blue balls, thinking about how much it would be nice to have sex.
Speaker 3:And and it is. And then also I've had like for me. One time I was apart from my partner for two months. We talk every day and then when I'm traveling, we talk all day so that I can be entertained through the day. And then we get there. We haven't seen each other in two months. We've talked every day for two months and he grabs me and puts me down to the bed and I was like can we connect first? And he's like what do you think we're about to do? This is the most intimate way I know how to connect with you. What is sex for you? And I was like, oh, my God, that's such a good question. And then I realized there in that moment, like, oh, I feel connected through communication and I haven't got to talk to you in person and that's different. But I loved the way that he just got curious and that's my other thing. So, advice, express appreciation and get curious rather than judgmental. And so in that moment I was like, okay, this is great, like he's wanting to connect. So, rather than men so often get judged for just being all about sex and men think with their dick and there's all of these things out there, I'm like, but you ladies, you don't understand what sex is for a man and you don't understand what it does for him.
Speaker 3:I was speaking with a guy that I was dating. He is like sex is when two souls come together and they merge, and this guy makes love like that too. You come together and they merge, and this guy makes love like that too. You know, like. And I was like oh my God, you just like. Or I wish I had that on video, cause I would use that in my courses. Just have them tell you again then. And another way where I saw this come up was I was teaching this in a workshop and a woman. She raised her hand and she was like so does that mean I have to have sex when I don't want to? And I said, no, definitely not.
Speaker 2:But that also means that you can't make him communicate and process when he doesn't want to.
Speaker 3:Oh yeah, you like that. We got a fast clap there. That's really good.
Speaker 2:I think that's just having respect for one another and what those needs are, and like understanding the differences. I think that's just like it's not all one sided.
Speaker 3:And we get so many preferences for us as women. Yeah, you know, like we can make you process for like five, six hours because we've got the endurance to do that, and I can explain that on biology as well. But if a guy wants sex, then we're going to start judging him. But because we want to talk, there's no judgment there placed on us besides the fact that we talk a lot, but that's kind of funny. Rather than judgment there placed on us besides the fact that we talk a lot but that's kind of funny, rather than like, no girls, that's a boundary violation. He's used up his words for the day and his brain is done I love this.
Speaker 3:That's great. I love this. Did that answer your question?
Speaker 1:yeah, no, that was great.
Speaker 3:That was exactly what I was looking for I felt like, as I was coming out, I was like like oh yeah, let me add it.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:I love that topic. Don't give him more ammo.
Speaker 2:Now he's going to be like. My words for the day are all used up, but it's actually a really helpful thing. I know it is a good.
Speaker 3:Because I have. I mean, I can go for a marathon If I'm talking and processing like I got it. But my partner sometimes, like we'd be in a process, and he's like, babe, my words are used up. And then I'm like, all right, let's stop, because if we keep going, this isn't going to be good and it's not going to like yeah, you're not going to get to show up the way that you want, you're going to get resentful and you're going to start to say things that both of us are going to regret that you said.
Speaker 1:So let's stop and we'll reconvene tomorrow. Men, a lot of men struggle with, like, the ability to articulate their emotions. And I mean, I struggle with it and I have pretty frequent therapy and I've read a lot of the books and all the things and I still struggle with articulation. So there's, I don't think I'm capable of any sort of emotional marathon, like communication wise, like I'm capable of sitting down and talking about shit, talking about sci-fi, the stars even if you want to talk about astrology I'll try to chime in but like the emotional side of men, particularly men we were just talking was I was talking about this with somebody the other day, that oh, on my date yesterday, about we were talking about particularly men that don't you hit, you hit midlife and you either figure some shit out about yourself or you don't and you just keep, just keep going on that trajectory of no emotions.
Speaker 1:And we've seen kind of where that goes Right and women too, women put on this trajectory. But there's something about, I think, midlife where you you kind of look and you really look in the mirror right, it's not a vanity thing anymore. You look in the mirror and you and you either see you want to change something or you see yourself and change isn't the right word. But you again, here I am struggling with articulation. But you, you look in the mirror and you realize who you are and you lean into that person right.
Speaker 1:Or you don't, you just keep going until you die, right? And I think men in particular, since we not, we're not really trained to tap into our emotions, to articulate our emotions, to have emotions, all these things, is that I think? I mean you can, it's, I mean the data is there that a lot of men just kind of stay on that trajectory, never get caught, never download Justine's, you know workshops, and it becomes really ugly.
Speaker 2:And it becomes ugly for their relationships.
Speaker 1:It becomes ugly for their relationships. It becomes ugly for themselves. It becomes ugly for their relationships with their family.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Particularly their children. And I'm not saying women don't go down this trajectory either, but I think men in particular, just they don't catch that sort of mid spot. And you understand what I'm trying to say? I do.
Speaker 3:And I'm going to take it a little bit of a tangent and totally different direction, but it is related. But learning how to articulate your emotions and this goes equally to men and women is a very important skill to learn, but to do it vulnerably and not attackingly, blaming, criticizing. So many people when they try to express their emotions, they do it in a blaming, criticizing way and then you're not going to get the support that you need.
Speaker 2:Or passive, aggressive or any of those sort of unhealthy I would say unhealthy ways.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and a big complaint I get is like oh, he gets so defensive and he justifies and he does all this and I'm like well, did you hear what you said to him? Because defensive, yeah, like you, you didn't share from a vulnerable place. You criticized him and there's. That is a skill that most people don't have and it is so worth learning and it is. It is a skill.
Speaker 2:How do you start learning Like how do you, how do you start that journey If you don't have that skill?
Speaker 3:hire you, hire me, take, take my courses, cause you'll learn it there in. In my courses, I do teach a lot around, like how to regulate your emotions, which I'm going to also say that, like ladies, we have eight times more blood flow to the emotional center of our brain than what men have.
Speaker 1:So our and we have eight times more blood flow to our other brain. I couldn't not say it Come on.
Speaker 2:High five. Come on, that was good. It all makes sense now. That was good, that was funny.
Speaker 3:I've actually I have said that fact so many times and I can't believe no man has ever brought that. But that was brilliant, that was good, that was funny, that was witty.
Speaker 1:Well, he's good for a good joke, yeah.
Speaker 3:Okay, get back on. I mean now I'm thinking, about eight times more blood flow. So, ladies, regulate your emotions and then talk to your man about your emotions, because when and we it happens too, like I get very excitable.
Speaker 3:So I'm like I'll come to my partner and I'm like, and I'm really excited he needs to brace himself because he's like there's a lot of energy and emotion and same. When we come with our anger or our sadness because they have eight times less, they're like oh shit, this is a big deal. And it's actually not that big of a deal. We're just way more expressive with it. But that's a whole nother thing too. And so, ladies, if you want to be heard and seen and held in your emotions, if you can try to regulate it a bit before you bring it to your man, and he's going to be able to be so much more present with you. So that was one. And now what was the? What were we talking about there? I'm on the second glass of wine and I don't.
Speaker 2:How to start, yeah, how to start communicating your emotions, yes, Okay.
Speaker 3:So one is learn how to truly process your emotions. Most people don't know how to properly process their emotions. This is such an important skill. I work with a lot of coaches and therapists as my clients. They think they know how to feel their emotions and then they realize, oh, I actually didn't know what I was doing. And that is one of the most important skills for you to learn, especially if you're a parent, but anything in life because when you learn how to feel your emotions, your whole life will change. Because we navigate our life so much based on avoidance, because we're afraid of feeling something, and when you realize like, oh shit, the worst that's going to happen is I'm going to feel something it is a superpower then it's great for dating, like you know. Get rejected, feel bad, lick your wounds for a day and then you're back on the game and you don't make a big deal about it.
Speaker 2:You don't get it. It's not like dragged out over this long, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3:So there's that. Another really great tool is NVC nonviolent communication. It's kind of a bitch to learn and it feels really mechanical, but it is a phenomenal framework and when you learn it.
Speaker 3:It is so good for teaching you how to communicate. I use NBC all the time but nobody knows how I do it Cause I don't do it. Nobody knows that I'm doing it Cause I don't do it mechanically because I practiced it so much, but it is a nonviolent communication. It's. It's an amazing tool. I highly recommend it. Marshall Rosenberg, you can do all kinds of free courses and stuff on on YouTube. There's tons of free information out there and if you really want to learn it, find a practice group, because practicing it is where you're going to really get it.
Speaker 3:And again, initially it's mechanical and it's annoying and it's kind of triggering when people like are in that stage. But the guy who taught it one time he was like he was learning this himself and his son was like dad, can I go out with my friends? And he was like trying to learn how to like say this in a way according to his NVC process and his dad's like, or his son's like dad, you know you take so much time. This, this whole method's annoying and he's like you want me to hurry it up? No, get the fucking sign. He's like take your time.
Speaker 2:Take your time.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I'm trying to get, yeah, so if you can just like be there for the process and be there for the learning curve. When you get to the other end of all of this stuff, when you learn how to communicate your emotions, when you learn how to feel your emotions, when you learn how to process your stress, all of this is going to just change your life. So yeah, did that answer your question? Yes, it did.
Speaker 2:It's a start. It Did that answer your question. Yes, it did. It's a start. It's a start, it's a start. Yeah, I have another question, but not till the end. It's not part of our conversation now, but it's a question. I was going to ask you if there's like one or two, I think we're getting.
Speaker 1:we can.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I don't know where we are on time.
Speaker 1:We'll have her back on.
Speaker 2:I love self-help books or like self-improvement books, and I know I feel like you do too.
Speaker 1:Based on what we've talked about all night tonight. What turns me on? Yeah, exactly, I hate that term, though, too. I know, self-improvement.
Speaker 3:How about personal development? Personal?
Speaker 2:development. Thank you, some of them are like cliche and just um um if there's like one or two, just maybe in the topic that we've talked about tonight or just in general that you have that are favorites, I'm sure there's a lot, but just one or two that you might recommend, maybe okay. So okay, I said that you didn't like attached, and then you gave us wait, was there? Was there another one that you mentioned earlier?
Speaker 3:they're getting the love you want is really good for understanding your core wounds why, did you attract your partner?
Speaker 3:into your life getting the love you want, so that one's good for that. For sex and understanding the differences of sex, between the masculine and feminine. Mars Venus in the Bedroom by John Gray. For emotions one of my favorite books on emotions is Language of Emotions by Carla McLaren Carla with a K, and she's got a website where she's got blogs where a lot of that stuff is broken, like a lot of her chapters are broken down into simple blogs. I found her because I was, I'm a very mental person. I did a lot of work to connect with my emotions. I did a lot of work to connect with my femininity. I'm, I'm, I'm a big work in progress. I did a lot of work over here, but I feel like we're always going to.
Speaker 3:We're always going to, always gonna be we are.
Speaker 1:You have to always evolve right, agree, I think you guys are amazing people. You're amazing, I mean, I don't disagree with that. But I'm, I'm not like I don't think any of my own goal of my second half my life is to surround myself by amazing human beings. I think I'm doing well.
Speaker 2:You're. You're also amazing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, lots of high fives going all around here, I just think, if we like, that's just my. I'm a growth mindset person. I don't ever see myself stopping that. Agreed, there's times I like take a little like. I'm like, okay, I'm good, I'm good where I'm at, and then something will happen. I'm like work on Okay, Where's a book I can find? Like how can I go dive into this next level? Right. But I don't see it as a like a negative. It's just like evolution over over life, right, like just learning more about myself and being a better version.
Speaker 2:But sorry, I didn't want to divert from that. Was there another?
Speaker 1:one yeah.
Speaker 3:So I found this because I was crying about not being emotional and I was like, oh God, I know, I know. And my geeky boyfriend was like, let's go to Google. He was like how does one learn about their emotions? And Carla McLaren came up and this book is so good If you're really emotional. You got no lucidity in the midst of your emotions. That book is good If you're really mental and you want to learn how to connect with your emotions and like what is an emotion?
Speaker 3:And like how do I feel it. That book is good, so that's one of my favorite emotion books. I also really like Letting Go by David Hawkins, and he's got a chapter in that book towards the end on relationships and what I. One of the things there is like, whatever you're feeling, whether you're saying it or not, you're thinking it and you're feeling it. The other person can feel it, just like a dog can feel you and a horse can feel you, people can feel you. So even though you haven't expressed it, you still need to be responsible for it, because they're picking up on that.
Speaker 2:And doesn't that also kind of going full circle back to where we started was, like with the non-negotiables is like just intention, right, like what you look for is what you're going to see, right, and so also like what you're feeling on the inside, like if you don't, you know you have to, like you're going to project that Right, and so I think there's a lot you're going to see there's some parallels there.
Speaker 3:You're going to filter that Like if you, if there is a pattern in your, in the people that you're attracting you are the common thread. Yep so you are the problem, so fix it yeah, if you're attracting unavailable men or or whatever, like if you're attracting something toxic, figure out what it is inside of you, don't be a victim of it. Yeah, be accountable for it.
Speaker 1:I love it and one last question, and then we'll ask her what is it the thing I'm curious on your? I'm curious, I'm a little curious.
Speaker 3:It kind of came up across my brain just a second ago what your thoughts are on therapy okay, I got a, I got opinions yeah so I studied psychology and after studying it I wanted nothing to do with it because I feel like therapy on a basis approaches people from the mindset that they're broken, and I don't like that. So I like to approach people. You're good as you are, we're just going to get you better.
Speaker 1:You're not broken therapy.
Speaker 3:When people come to me I ask have you ever done coaching or therapy before? Most people have done therapy. A lot of people haven't done coaching and I say what worked and what didn't work. The most common answer I get is I know why, I'm fucked up, I don't know what to do about it. And so therapy a lot of times can focus on the past and it fails to bring tools and it fails to bring integration. I have one friend. She got triggered in her relationship. She went into a dismissive state she was stuck in. It said well, what are your tools? She's been in therapy for 12 years. She goes tools. I was like actionable.
Speaker 2:What are your?
Speaker 3:tools. She's like I don't have tools. Like I mean, if you work with me, I want you to work with me for one package or two package, you're gonna have tools so you don't need me anymore. Like I do not want you needing me and staying with me, whereas I think a lot of people go to therapy for years, but a lot of times what they're doing is like therapists and not all but therapists were programmed to empathize. So for somebody who has never had a secure attached relationship, then that is the first time that they have a secure attached relationship. So great Empathize away with that person.
Speaker 3:But otherwise, sometimes, like I had one therapist as a client and she was so stuck on her stories sometimes, and after I knew her stories, I knew her past and she started to go down the same thing I said, sweetheart, I'm going to interrupt you right now. Do I need to know this? And she was like no, but I want you to. And I said, but I already know the theme Is this how you want to use your time? And in that she walked away from that and she goes. I, I always trauma bond, I always talk about the negative, I always talk about the past. And then she came back the next time and she's like two things came up. I don't know how to connect with people outside of not talking about the negative and the trauma. Yeah, and two, she was a therapist and she said I think I'm keeping my patients stuck because I'm validating their stories and so I'm keeping them in the narrative.
Speaker 2:That has that that they continue to play out in their life, sort of going back to that whole like concept of treating a symptom rather than the root cause.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:And there's so much of that across the board, whether it be in medicine or what you know just I don't even know what other the food, nutrition, like, all the things right Like. It's like you're always just treating the symptom rather than the root cause. So I really love that differentiation between therapy and coaching and I do agree with you. I think therapy is wonderful. It like kind of helps you identify what those things are, maybe where something came from, but it doesn't always give you the tools to move forward. And coaching is more forward-looking.
Speaker 3:But coaching has its limitations too. Yeah, because coaching is all about like what is the future or how do we get there? And sometimes people can't do that. They can't step into that version of themselves because they've got core wounds and subconscious programming yeah, so if you could bring both together.
Speaker 3:And this is I mean, this is a I have a therapeutic plus coaching approach, because if I can't get somebody to step into this person or take this action, then I got to go back and rewire, and I'm all about rewiring instead of just regulating, which is a whole, nother topic of itself. But yeah, does that answer your?
Speaker 1:question.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that question I have, I do too because I think therapy is therapies.
Speaker 1:It's not all created equal, by any means oh, you know what all?
Speaker 3:therapists are not all created equal no, I mean no, but nobody is. It's a numbers game. You got to find who works with you like I don't work for everybody, and so it's just about like finding your resonance. But also in therapy, there's a lot of therapists like Like, if they're working with one person, they're like oh, I won't work with your partner. I have an Imago therapy, the book Getting the Love you Want. They also really recommend what I'm about to say, which is like I think it's really good for couples to work with the same therapist, because if you're working with different therapists, you're going to go tell your therapist your perception. You're going to go tell your therapist your perception. You're going to go tell your therapist your perception, they're going to validate it, and then you're going to come and just go at each other.
Speaker 2:So it's going to amplify it or polarize them even more.
Speaker 3:I want to know both people's perceptions, because the reality is somewhere in between. So a lot of times when I work with couples, we do couple sessions and we do individual sessions, because I can be so much more effective in working with you one-on-one and I can be more direct with you than I would be in a couple of session, because I'm not going to just go at you in a couple of session. The way that I will hold you accountable, you can also call bullshit, though right In a one-on-one is a much safer container where?
Speaker 3:you're going to be able to hear and receive that better Right and so.
Speaker 2:It's going to, it's going to genuinely help them.
Speaker 3:So if you're if you're actually looking for support and help, rather than someone to just validate you so you can you know, and I record my sessions too, so sometimes where I've been able to have big breakthroughs, especially with the men, is like I go back and I look at the timestamps and I'm like at 1456, you totally invalidated her. Go back and watch that.
Speaker 2:And then they start to see what their wife has been complaining about the whole time and they watch them do it and they're like now I understand that's invalidating. Okay, self-awareness is really hard and I think a lot of people don't have it. Even people that are good at it have their moments. I mean, I try to be self-aware and there's there's times I listen back to these podcasts and I'm like what did I say? Like what the heck? But this has been like a wonderful tool for me. I go back and listen so that I can improve right.
Speaker 2:Like and have better awareness, but there's a lot of people who don't have it. I, I. That's one of the things that I really love about doing. This podcast is like it's it's teaching me a lot of about myself too, right? So there was something. Your good old growth mindset.
Speaker 1:I have one more question right now Go ahead.
Speaker 2:Not for you. When will you come back and talk to us, cause there's so many things I feel like we just like just hit the tip of the iceberg. You can have me whenever you want me.
Speaker 3:Oh yeah, I also want to do a.
Speaker 1:Love. Lab lounge with you again, and get updates on where you're at with the dating.
Speaker 3:I picked up a chata. I'm like you what I picked up a chata. I'm dancing a lot more than I'm dating right now.
Speaker 1:That's awesome. Yeah, that's awesome yeah, that's awesome wednesday night at the grizzly rose oh boy, free dance lessons.
Speaker 3:Country line dancing yeah, a little different.
Speaker 1:I mean, they do bring country dancers into I'm a free dancer, so anytime it's organized, I'm like what?
Speaker 2:kind of dancing is this? I don't latin. It's great because, like I do, it.
Speaker 3:I do. I do it at denver bachata fantastic studio, okay, but like I get, I mean like I'm getting touched, I'm getting caressed and like I love I get to grind with guys and then I go home I'm like that was great I think they're enjoying themselves too.
Speaker 2:So probably more than you are, but I don't know I'm pretty happy yeah. Okay, well, it's been around, bend me over. Oh, boy yeah.
Speaker 3:Joel's.
Speaker 2:It's getting hot, yep it is down to the last layer of clothes in here. I don't know, got some spicy topics.
Speaker 3:Yeah, spicy food, there you go. A little wine, that's right, a lot of wine.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think it's a good place to end.
Speaker 2:Okay, joel's distracted, it's fine. It's okay, blood flow.
Speaker 1:Think about the next episodes. Well, I appreciate you, Justine.
Speaker 3:Thank you for coming on.
Speaker 1:We'll make sure that I'll make sure to get all the stuff that you want us to promote and we'll put this on social media and it'll be published, probably on Tuesday.
Speaker 3:On Tuesday. Well, with that said, I'm having a free event for women. It's Women in Wine on the 13th of December, so I'll get you that link as well 13th of December, so I'll I'll get you that link as well.
Speaker 1:13th of December, when is that Next Friday?
Speaker 3:Next Friday Good job, way to go. Calendar.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we'll make sure to put that on there.
Speaker 3:So yeah, if you want to come, and it's just for women to come and ask questions and I'm just going to do hot seat coaching or answer questions.
Speaker 3:The last one was a lot of fun, I love that there's a great group of I mean we think we'll have a different group of women coming this time around, but it's, it's, it's a chance. And then, yeah, come January I'll be there. You get some guys. I mean, if there, if there's guys that would show up and want to do it, then I would, so do it for men. I just I got I got more lady friends in Colorado, so I'm going to. I know this sounds really cliche, but I feel like you should have your own podcast.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you should, or you can just be a regular on ours, I'll be a regular on yours, and then you can be like, okay, go back and listen to this podcast episode yeah. I'll let you guys do the work. You're great on this, though.
Speaker 1:Well thank you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, this was very insightful and I have plans next Friday, but if you do that again, I would love to come.
Speaker 3:I'll do one more in Jan at some point, okay, and then I might shut them down. I don't know, we'll see. But I'll run my women's program for the last time in January and the men's somewhere like two weeks after that, okay.
Speaker 1:Perfect Wow. Thank you, we'll weeks after that okay, perfect, well, thank you, we'll see you again. Appreciate you guys. Yeah, oh, homework non-negotiable, do your homework. Five non-negotiables yes, exactly, yeah, love it all right, all right oh my gosh, that was great.
Speaker 2:I'm trying to.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think that's good mic drop alright, everybody, remember to follow us on Instagram at midlifeuncensored and I guess, if you want to follow us on Facebook and we want to hear from you, slip into our DMs. Let us know what's going on, share your stories and please subscribe and rate us. It goes a long ways. It means a lot as we grow here. Bye, bye.
