Midlife Uncensored
Midlife Uncensored-Real Life Discussions from Over the Hillis the no-holds-barred podcast you didn’t know you needed. Hosted by Joel Poppert, aka Poppy—the friendly Sasquatch with an epic beard—and his fiery co-host, Emanuela Messineo, aka E, this show unapologetically dives into the chaos, comedy, and WTF moments of midlife. If you’re 35-55 and ready to embrace the rollercoaster of aging, this podcast is your new home base.
Poppy and E tackle everything from modern dating disasters in the hilarious sub-series The Love Laugh Lounge (the “festivus” of dating) to real-life shit like divorce, mental breakdowns, balding, sagging tits, and figuring out how to parent while still figuring yourself out and maybe dealing with an unhinged ex. With a blend of interview episodes and no-expert-needed banter (except when we bring on experts), these two cut through the BS and get real about midlife—no filters, no sugarcoating, just pure, unfiltered truth with a heavy dose of humor. Expect raw, relatable stories, unfiltered guidance, tough love, easy happiness, and a few episodes where the comedy comes from alcohol infused banter, because who give a fuck, right?
Whether you’re dealing with the joys of aging, trying to keep your sanity while raising kids, or attempting to find love in a sea of idiots, Midlife Uncensored has your back. Expect a few F-bombs, some belly laughs, and a whole lot of honesty as Poppy and E rip the band-aid off midlife and give you permission to thrive in this beautifully messy chapter. It's not just about surviving midlife—it's about unfucking it and owning it! This is your community; we are in it together!
Midlife Uncensored
A Discussion about Self-Confidence, Dating Yourself and Taylor Swift
Ever found yourself chuckling at the absurdity of grilling in a blizzard or dancing unabashedly to Taylor Swift regardless of your age? Well, my fellow goofballs, you're in for a treat. Poppy here, your hirsute hermit of hilarity, joined by the witty and Owning Alone's new Co-Host, Emanuela Messineo, and together we're tearing down the conventional walls of modern living and personal growth. We're peeling back the layers on the quirky intersections of life that make for rich storytelling and even richer learning.
Giving a nod to the digital age, Emanuela and I untangle the complexities of social media's evolving landscape, and how it intersects with the cultural phenomena like Swifties. But it's not all pop culture and internet trends; we're getting real about the carousel of dating, confidence, and the thrills of self-discovery. Hear us swap tales and offer advice on navigating the sometimes choppy but always navigable dating seas—with resilience as our compass and authenticity as our north star. And, yes, we even dissect the dreaded bill-splitting etiquette, because who hasn't been there, right?
Wrapping up, we're not just here to talk at you; we're here to build a community with you. So, we're throwing open the doors and inviting you to share in the conversation, the laughs, and the occasional awkward dating escapade. If you’ve got a story that screams ‘Only Alone’ or just want to bask in the camaraderie of life’s goofy moments, we're your squad. Emanuela and I can't wait to share this journey with you, so tune in, turn up the volume, and let's get this confessional booth of a podcast started!
How to Engage with Us
- Email us at joel@owningalonepodcast.com
- DM us on Instagram midlifeuncensored
- Follow Joel on IG jpoppert
- Follow Emanuela on IG emanuela5683 or accountability_with_e
Thanks for joining the Owning Alone community, I certainly appreciate you!
Welcome back to another episode of the Only Alone podcast. This is your host Poppy, your favorite middle-aged Sasquatch with the epic beard game the epic beard game, and today I'm joined by our brand new co-host, emanuela Messinaio. I say her your name about 50 million times, but I still get it wrong. It's okay. I was born, I'm part German and Irish. I don't got an Italian. But I still get it wrong. It's okay, I was born, I'm part German and Irish. I've got an Italian in me, it's okay.
Speaker 2:It's okay, you will learn. Welcome to the show.
Speaker 1:You're the greatest addition to the Odin and Olin podcast.
Speaker 2:What time is it and how much wine have you had?
Speaker 1:I've had zero wine. It's like two o'clock I. What wine have you had? I've had zero wine. It's like 2 o'clock. I've been smoking meat since 7 o'clock this morning. I woke up basically in my pajamas and started rubbing my meat.
Speaker 2:Hey, nothing wrong with that. I like it what are you rubbing meat for?
Speaker 1:Well, you know we're having a big barbecue tomorrow. Smoking what did I call it? The wine, the hell, not barbecue. An excuse for me to fire up the smoker. And as soon as I fired it up, it woke up this morning with for all of you guys that aren't in Colorado it's fucking snowing right now. It's April 20th, happy 420. There's about three inches of snow on the ground and tomorrow it's supposed to be 70. So we'll be having a barbecue in sloppy, uncut grass. I forgot to pick the dog poop up before it snowed, but anyway, we're like before I get too deep into it we're like skipping over the fact that, like you're now a podcast host.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Thank you, yeah thank you, we'll have to go down to I think it was the great divide brewery or whatever where the sasquatch is and take a picture so we can get you on the cover.
Speaker 1:But I appreciate you. I think this is great. I you know I've been struggling to, you know, have the dialogue. I think that I really want to have and getting guests every week and with my full, my schedules. This is me great and we, we did, we hammered it last week and it was great. So tell me how you feel about it, I love it.
Speaker 2:I mean, I think you, I, I genuinely like love our conversations, just like off script too. So I think this is gonna fantastic. That's just like my own personal opinion, I think it's going to be great too.
Speaker 2:But also I think you have a lot to say and a lot to share, and I don't think you were getting the opportunity to do that with just like having random people that you were interviewing and, while it was like very beneficial information, like I think this will be really cool because I'll be able to ask you questions, you'll be able to share things that otherwise people weren't necessarily like asking you of.
Speaker 1:So yeah, I mean, there's a million benefits. I think we're both. It's fun. It'll be fun to have, you know, like a female perspective on every show and have the dialogue and the and you know, we've built up our own familiarity with each other and, yeah, it's going to be great. And before we get too deep into it, I forget to always do this. I do this at the end, assuming that everybody listens to the whole episode. Please follow us on Instagram at owningalone I also. We both have our own Instagram handles. Emanuela has accountability at E and I have jpoppert, my personal one, and then I'm also on the TikTok. There also is a Facebook page too, but I think there's like nine followers.
Speaker 2:But, more importantly, Everybody's like over 60, I'm in, yeah.
Speaker 1:Facebook is. I let Facebook go and now all I get is like weird, nobody uses Facebook anymore. Really.
Speaker 2:I know Well, it's like a weird dynamic. Yeah, that's okay.
Speaker 1:I mean, I think people use it to like for events and stuff. That's kind of why I got back on after a while Thank God I don't have a lot of people on there because it's the politics and stuff but like, yeah, even Instagram now it seems like I actually read this the day that I think social activity on social media is actually on a decline.
Speaker 2:That's maybe good overall.
Speaker 1:They might ban TikTok next week, which is interesting. You've been following that. I don't follow it too hard.
Speaker 2:I'm not on TikTok talk I there was an issue with with it that, like our, my, the company I work for banned it like from banned us from having the app on our phone like years ago.
Speaker 1:So I just I find tiktok, to be kind of I. I mean, I made a video yesterday I'm sure people saw, in honor of taylor swift album drop, which was partly to make fun of swifties. But I also love Swifties too.
Speaker 2:My nieces are Swifties, you know lots of people are, but also because you are the doppelganger of Kelsey Webb.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, jason Kelsey. Yeah, recent date said I look like Kelsey, jason Kelsey.
Speaker 2:Not so much, but yeah, you have a beard, I'll take it.
Speaker 1:I'll take it, that's all right, I'm pretty big, but yeah, I don't think I'm Jason Kelsey and she's a big Swifty, so maybe that's why she likes me, because I remind her of Taylor Swift's boyfriend's brother. Yeah, there you go.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's all you got to do. It's all good. Well, you guys can be some yeah.
Speaker 1:I wouldn't date Taylor Swift. She's never around it wouldn't work.
Speaker 2:Well, yep, that's a good boundary to have.
Speaker 1:We've talked about. Well, Taylor Swift has emerged on multiple episodes, One of Alyssa. Actually, I really have a lot of respect for Taylor Swift.
Speaker 2:I think, she.
Speaker 1:She thinks she owns her alone.
Speaker 2:I don't think I'll ever get her on the show, so have you watched her documentary?
Speaker 1:No.
Speaker 2:It's, it's, it's interesting.
Speaker 1:I just let everybody tell me about her.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I, I I didn't finish it yet, but it is actually one that we should probably both watch. I do agree with you owning her alone and also like very successful. It's an interesting story, and like I haven't finished it, but the start of it was like really good, so hey.
Speaker 1:That's my Alexa.
Speaker 2:Yep, now she's listening.
Speaker 1:Uh-oh, she's always listening.
Speaker 2:I know.
Speaker 1:I probably should turn her off when we do the podcast Wait till she starts like repeating it back.
Speaker 2:I know.
Speaker 1:I probably should turn her off when we do the podcast.
Speaker 2:Wait until she starts repeating it back or answering. Just ask her a question.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'll just say one word. Hey, who?
Speaker 2:needs a co-host when you have her. Right she could chime in. I mean, that would be pretty interesting actually.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:We should have her as a guest.
Speaker 1:Well, you don't know this yet because you haven't got into the editing, but I descript has built an ai voice for me.
Speaker 2:So when you edit voice yeah, so like it's.
Speaker 1:So when you're editing you know when you need to like, fill something in, so descript. What it does is it transcribes our whole podcast and it turns it into words and then you edit by removing the words from the transcript and then it removes the audio, right?
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:But if you want to like fill something in, which would be much easier instead of like recording, you just type in blah, blah, blah.
Speaker 2:Something to like fill a gap. Yeah, okay.
Speaker 1:I wanted to say this phrase or reword it. It has built a voice for me to fill it.
Speaker 2:That's so cool.
Speaker 1:But I haven't used it yet because it wants me to pay more money to use it, of course, but it has built a voice. That's really cool, oh it's crazy the AI stuff is. I don't think I could do this podcast without the.
Speaker 2:AI stuff. There's so much I have to learn about that.
Speaker 1:There's a lot I have to learn I use ai for yeah for a lot of stuff lately, but that's off topic. So what else happened this week? Everybody loved my taylor swift video. I love my taylor swift.
Speaker 2:One friend did reach out and say ask if I was okay shut up, I mean everybody yeah, yeah, right, okay, that's expected to my friend that asked me that. Who hasn't?
Speaker 1:seen me in a long time. I am doing wonderful. I just got bored yesterday on a snow day and it made me any excuse to wear the disco dan outfit.
Speaker 2:I love that you're trying like the tiktok stuff, and good for you well, I my thing, but maybe I need to now.
Speaker 1:No, no, no, you don't have to go down the TikTok route.
Speaker 2:But I think it's cool that you're you're doing that.
Speaker 1:I just think it's fun to like do the lip sync thing. I don't, I, you know. My motto now, which I'm trying to trademark, is live life goofy. That's my. I'm sort of trademarking that it's on my stuff and I sort of like goofy and confident at the same time yeah. I don't think you ever can be too old to be goofy, and I think it's even more funny when you're older and doing goofy shit.
Speaker 1:So I'm not doing it to make any point, make you know a lot of people that said I have a lot of friends with daughters, teenage daughters. I have my own nieces and I. I got a lot of feedback that like they thought it was super funny. One of the girls I'm dating has thought it was funny, so you know it. It got some runway yesterday.
Speaker 2:yeah, I mean, I think she's like big, like role model to a lot of the women and like especially girls right now. So, but the Taylor Swift thing, I think it's cool Like you're yeah, you're, you're engaged with some someone who is like a really big role model to just middle-aged women, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 1:Or no. It's interesting how people I got nothing People love Taylor Swift and they I don't know much about her music and stuff. I'm not. I'm sure I've listened to him, sure it's good, but I have, like I appreciate I mean anybody that has something that they they're passionate about. Um, you know, I think that's great. I have friends that make fun of her, but they like fly around and go to fish shows too. So I'm like what's?
Speaker 2:oh my god, yeah right, yeah exactly there's not wooks at the wookies.
Speaker 1:You ever heard of a wookie?
Speaker 2:what's a wookie? A wookie, a wookie.
Speaker 1:You ever heard of a wookie? See, we've been to a fish show, or?
Speaker 2:like I've been to a fish show but you don't like the people that are all like strung out with, like dreadlocks yes they basically go from show to show and sell burritos until they made enough money to go to the next show. Like they're they just look like wooks.
Speaker 1:They look like dead men walking Cause they've done too many drugs or like either mouth to side of sideways like this I have been to a fish show and yeah, so I have.
Speaker 2:I have friends that that do this like on the regular, but when they come into town and they want to stay with me, I make them buy me a ticket, whatever they're doing. I'm like you can have a free place to stay, but then you get to buy me a ticket to whatever show we're going to.
Speaker 1:That's the trade-off so I know a fish show that way it was an incredible show actually like I.
Speaker 2:so the same weekend that I went it was a few years ago it was the fish show and J-Rad was at Red Rocks, okay. Which is like the Russo's almost dead. So it's like and forgive me because I'm not a fish or Grateful Dead person, but it's like, I think some attribute to the Grateful Dead.
Speaker 1:J-Rad.
Speaker 2:J-Rad is that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm out of that loop too.
Speaker 2:I used to get into that. So incredible shows. I loved the Fisk show, though I loved both of them, did you?
Speaker 1:go to Dick's.
Speaker 2:Yes, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:That's the one I go to too. I always get free tickets because my buddy works at the Rapids, so you can get a ticket.
Speaker 2:I feel like, yeah, so that's where they always do that show, I think.
Speaker 1:I have a bunch of friends that are at the Spear right now at the fish show at Spear.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah. Which I think would be really fun. Yeah, we're not with the guy that was going there for that. Yeah, that didn't work out, so I'm not there.
Speaker 1:Work out With the guy.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it didn't work out.
Speaker 1:Even if it did work out, I don't know if I'd go to Vegas for anybody.
Speaker 2:Don't bend their dumb ass. Vegas is a hard one. I don't like Vegas For me.
Speaker 1:I would rather spend my time anywhere else than.
Speaker 2:Vegas. Yeah, I don't disagree with you. I don't disagree with you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, guarante guaranteed that the pool has more pee in it than chlorine $20 for beers. And then I can lose Unless you're gambling, is gambling your thing? No, yeah, me neither. I don't mind gambling, but I'm not into hookers, me neither.
Speaker 2:I'm not into $20 beers.
Speaker 1:I'm not into like 105 degree weather and being inside all day.
Speaker 2:I would like, if I could just like, go there and get a cabana attached to my room with a private pool, that would be ideal.
Speaker 1:But couldn't you go anywhere else to do that?
Speaker 2:I mean sure, yeah, I'll go, I'll go do that anywhere.
Speaker 1:You can fly direct to Mexico right now and do it for like a third of the cost.
Speaker 2:Okay Well, I've never do that anywhere. You can fly direct to Mexico right now and do it for like a third of the cost. Okay Well, I've never been to Mexico what I know, one of those places I've just never been, yeah you need to go to Mexico. I know, I know, yeah, needs to happen.
Speaker 1:Take this show on the road. Yes, what else happened this week? I got an email from a listener that really enjoyed the one I did solo.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:He's going through a divorce right now and said it really helped him and stuff and gave him some perspective. And I enjoy that when our listeners write in and we need more. We need to advocate for more content. So, people, please reach out, tell us your stories, what you, what's working, what's not. We'll bring you on the show too. Maybe I don't know, but like, definitely engage with us and yeah so so I'd like on that I mean I had a couple people.
Speaker 2:So the last episode that we did, I I've been like trying to share it with like friends and stuff and some are married, some are not. I asked some people to share it just to like get the word out, and it's like interesting what the response is. But I I've gotten some like good, good feedback from people too, and I think my takeaway from all of it without going into like too many details is I think this is really good for people who are single and married or in relationships like any spectrum, but it seems like the name makes people think that it's only for people who are single.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we talk about single, but I agree with you and I've actually, I've, actually, I have enough data to realize to know that, like a a lot of, there's a lot of married people that are listening to this show, and I encourage that. I look, we're going to talk about dating and we're going to talk about being single and rolling solo, because that's that's that's who we are. We're both single, and but I also. The other part of this show is also about the owning alone has multiple contexts. It's one of them is to is owning the relationship with yourself right, and that it owning alone can be translated directly to owning the relationship with yourself, which is going to help married people and, if you want to like, get some perspective on our world yep then listen in, because yeah
Speaker 2:that's where we're at, and I just thought I'd mentioned that Cause you're yeah, you're talking about somebody going through a divorce and I feel like that's like a lot of the focus or references that you make. But I do think that this is going to be like really beneficial for people who are also married, and maybe even more so for them, so that they statistically, 30, 30 to 40 percent of them aren't going to be married at some point in their life too.
Speaker 2:Yeah, right, yeah so like I, it's just interesting so I just thought I'd mention that. But yeah, so yeah, that's cool.
Speaker 1:I think that happened to me when I first started too. I'm still trying to get my friend out in portland on here and I had to explain to her like it's not just for single people. She's in a healthy relationship now. She's like very happy.
Speaker 2:She's the woman that had a kid on her own all the more reason like get on here, tell us, like what you, what you did how'd you get through it? That's okay.
Speaker 1:Bring your boyfriend even better, even better, and you know we could be doing this for a long time and I'm assuming somebody will get in a relationship, statistically, hopefully, hopefully, and I'm not giving up. I'm not giving up on the love laugh lounge. That's still going strong and I'm always looking for guests for the love laugh lounge. So hit me up if you want to tell your war stories. That's pure comedy, yeah. So I kind of told manuela that she to take the, take the reins today and come up with a topic. So do you want to sort of dive in a little bit and tell me what you want to talk about?
Speaker 2:yeah, I thought it would be cool to talk about in like the spirit of owning alone, like how do we build self-confidence to like own our own right or own our own wherever we are, and so building self-confidence? I was just listening to a podcast this week and they described it pretty simply, which was confidence or self-confidence is really just like trusting yourself and so doing things to help you get get to that like level of self-confidence means that you have to like take action and and do things to help you get there. I'm rambling now.
Speaker 1:I mean, that's the whole point of podcast. It's fine to ramble, I'm just like talking in circles. Yeah, this is what we do.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so that sort of like segues into this idea of like. I feel like when I'm actively going on a lot of like first dates, I have to take a step back and go into this, like make sure that I'm also taking time for myself and doing things that help me like recenter Right, and doing things that help me like recenter right, so like help me kind of build that trust like with myself and like a concept of like dating myself to in addition to dating other people, just to again like recenter, so like is that something that you do too? Or like how, what are, I think, like what are some things that you do to gain your own like self-confidence in this like dating worlds? And how do you keep a level head and like not get discouraged when you're going on a lot of first dates?
Speaker 1:in terms of self-confidence, I guess just confidence in general, but but like one, I listen to Mark Manson and I think not just Mark Manson, but Mark Manson, I think usually his daily quotes and stuff. But he had something out there the other day about All of the things this is a perspective thing all the things that you get anxious about that people are thinking of you, they're not. Yeah, people just generally don't think about you all that much period, and you know. So part of confidence is part of my confidence is really to remember that I want to be authentic. I want to be myself, but not falsely authentic, and I kind of own my space right, I own my principles, I'm principled, I remind myself of my principles, I I make the decisions that I think are appropriate for me and my principles and stay grounded and try not to get pulled in any direction unless I've thought over it. In terms of dating and confidence and showing up confident, I think it all goes back to knowing who you are.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:And being okay, particularly as a man. Being okay with rejection is one. If we're just talking about dating, confidence equals being okay with rejection. Now I'm rambling.
Speaker 2:No, it's totally, but yeah principles.
Speaker 1:I think principles are super important.
Speaker 2:But yeah, sorry, like being okay with reject. Sorry I'm interrupting you, but like being okay with rejection yeah, I know I'm going to. It's going to happen.
Speaker 1:Whenever you think you're interrupting me. Think of Jared Freed and Jordan.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I know, yeah, like well I'm. This is why, like, I have this like notebook, so I was like I need to be able to write notes down.
Speaker 1:I'm writing notes too here. I'm trying.
Speaker 2:I'm trying so that I don't interrupt you, but like being okay with rejection, I think obviously that comes with resilience, right? So how do you maintain that resiliency in the dating world, like cause that's there's, there's like a sort of I get?
Speaker 1:rejected eight times in a row and still get up in the morning and do it again. Yes, I mean eight times in a row is a lot.
Speaker 1:I just think, I just like, like I believe that I am a good person, like I believe I'm an attractive person. I work to be in shape, I work to be well read, I go to therapy, I and I get a lot of perspective and I own my shit like. So again, I'm gonna go back to Mark Manson, because I read the book models and models gave. I recommend that every man at least read models, because models is. It just gives you some really interesting perspective on why and women too, like why there's a million reasons why you're being rejected and most of them aren't because of you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and we're also like yeah, they're because of I mean yeah.
Speaker 1:And we're also like yeah, they're because of I mean, you can't change to be good for that person, but you, we, like I guess I just wake up and remember that like I'm valuable to this world and I'm valuable to these people. And you know, I also don't leave a date when I get rejected and be like her fucking loss, like I don't do that either, because that's that's stupid too.
Speaker 2:It's not like anybody's differences, right, like it's okay. There was something you said and I I kind of lost it, but it's. It's amazing that you are able to just go in authentically and just be who you are. You know, I think that's like amazing, and we've talked about this several times that like, just be who you are. I think that's amazing. We've talked about this several times that not everybody's meant for everybody else. Okay, to meet people, learn from them, enjoy an experience of a date with them and then go your separate ways, if you're not the right match, you don't need to be.
Speaker 1:What did I read the other day? Read on a little nudge, I wish she probably saw that stuff. And it was like some guy had she was asking people's thoughts, some some girl had, which I thought was weird too. She, she did this whole. They show the text she decided to.
Speaker 1:She texted the guy before the date ask if it's if, if they were going to just to set expectations, if, if, if she was going to have to pay for the date or him, and he said, no, it's okay, I'll pay for the date. Which guys like yeah, pay for the first date, come on, like this is just shiverly one-on-one. If you don't think it's right, then then I'm sorry, that's your fucking problem and this is what it is. And but then he, like she did the, she did like the respectable thing. He asked her if he wanted enough, she wants she. He asked her if she'd like to go on another date and she respectively said look, I'm not, you know, I had a great time, I appreciate you and but I just wasn't feeling it to go on another date, which is like template, shit right, but it's the thing, right thing to do and he fucking sent her a venmo for 25, like, come on, like that's your ego, that's not attractive.
Speaker 1:He was sour about it, I who goes on dates for 24 bucks, by the way. I know I was like it's I was Midwest when I saw that post.
Speaker 2:actually, I immediately thought of your $400. Yeah, I was like oh okay.
Speaker 1:Which about my dates on here? No, it's okay we shouldn't do that.
Speaker 2:But in in general, like yeah, it was funny. I had the same thought like who goes on it? But a $24 date, but it's okay.
Speaker 1:It's just you know, if you're out there, as you're out there dating and you have you're, you can't handle your ego thing. This goes into like the article I sent you to where, like, we're fucking dating at like a frequency that no generation has ever dated.
Speaker 2:So like, if you can't handle rejection, get off the fucking ride so I don't know if you've read the responses to that post at all, because I was.
Speaker 2:I was interested in it because she did okay, so just to back up for people that don't don't follow this like page, it's a a dating coach who she's in brooklyn but she puts a lot of good content out and about like how to respond to messages and things like that and like what, what like just trying to help people come up with responses.
Speaker 2:Number one to like avoid ghosting, like being able to like kindly say, like thank you for the dates but not interested in moving on, or things like that in and moving on, or things like that. So, anyways, this is somebody she was coaching and they were asking, I think, for feedback about how to respond to his follow-up for paying for half of the date. Well, she initially said like asked for, asked for like the expectation of like okay, are you going to pay for this or not? And he said, well, unless I like lose my wallet, I'm going to pay for it. And then in the end she declined a second date and then he sent the Venmo request and she's like put off by that. I kind of. So if you read the responses, some people were like weird that she asked for that expectation ahead of time.
Speaker 2:Also, like if she knew in the moment as leave like at the time they were leaving the date that she didn't want one, I feel like a second date. I feel like she should have it. This is what I would have done. I would have paid for half the date. Like I would just offer to split it, but she already set that expectation that he was going to pay for it, and that's fine. I don't know Like what. So, like this, this gets us into like, what are your rules of like dating? Like, do you always pay for a first date, regardless of like how you feel about the person?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I usually. I always pay for the first date, yeah, even if I don't want to go on a second one. And then I text them later and tell me everything and then memo them for twice as much as I paid.
Speaker 2:For twice as much. Make them pay for the whole date. Like you don't like what you pay them for twice as much as I paid for twice as much. Make them pay for the whole date.
Speaker 1:Like you don't like what you pay? Yes, I do. I think some women I've talked about this before on the love love lounge some women offer to pay, which I think is nice, Some women don't, which is fine. I don't see that as snotty or anything, it's just kind of like that's been sort of the way it has been for quite a long time and I think that you know women should have that expectation, I guess.
Speaker 2:Yeah, sure Maybe no. I don't think women should have the expectation that a guy's going to pay for it.
Speaker 1:Really.
Speaker 2:I don't.
Speaker 1:You don't have that expectation typically when you go on a date.
Speaker 2:I mean I think it's nice. I don't. You don't have that expectation typically when you go on a date. I mean I think it's nice.
Speaker 1:You guys should have the self-confidence to pay for yourselves.
Speaker 2:We should, I do.
Speaker 1:We were talking about confidence, right I?
Speaker 2:do have the confidence to pay for myself. I think if I genuinely had a good time regardless of whether I want to go on a second date or not if we had a good time, I will let them pay for it so wait if you're, but go ahead.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, go ahead. So what you're telling me, that is, if a girl offers to pay, I should take that as she doesn't want to go on a second date, I should probably my take should probably save my money. I couldn't know.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's my take. Well, but that that isn't what it used to be. I I used to just offer because I wasn't sure, like like it was just a first date. It was like I didn't know yet either way, or I don't know, like I just would offer out of respect for the fact that we're out there dating and guys are spending a lot of money. I have my own money, I don't. I don't know, I wasn't looking for a free ride. I think is why I I've like used to offer to pay. I don't anymore, because I think I'm also trying to like attract a different type of person and so, like I want someone who's who wants to pay. I don't know, that sounds very terrible, maybe it's chivalrous.
Speaker 2:I think it's associated with someone who is like in his like male energy, and I feel like that's like a a normal thing for male energy, someone I don't know to do so. No, I think it's pretty normal, especially if I'm having a good time and want to go on a second date, I will like let them pay, yeah.
Speaker 1:I mean I'll let a girl pay or share. If we get into, like, the multiple date territory, yeah, it's fine, or?
Speaker 2:like if we go to a second place, I'll like pay for like a round of drinks at like a second place. That's like an ideal, like if we have dinner and then we go like next door to have drinks or something like that.
Speaker 1:But yeah, yeah, so, yeah, okay, okay don't make them pay afterwards, though that's weird no, that's like very weird.
Speaker 2:And then that guy found her on which is even more weird I feel like I can't even find my own friends on venmo, like he had to do some stalking for to find it's weird behavior.
Speaker 1:It's probably younger. They're probably younger, it's. He should feel a little shame.
Speaker 2:Yeah, he was petty a little bit petty, but maybe he felt like I. My guess is that he felt like she was lining up a free date, maybe by asking ahead of time. I think if she hadn't have asked ahead of time he probably wouldn't would have let it go, you know. But the fact that she before like I can't remember the details did she wait to agree on the date until he had agreed to pay for it?
Speaker 2:I don't know the whole thing doesn't matter anyways, the whole thing's weird. And then we don't see the whole like we don't see every side of everything.
Speaker 1:Who the hell knows? Who knows what they talked about who knows how she acted like yep, we don't actually know.
Speaker 1:I think it's more like trying to tie this back to self-confidence is just, at least from. You know, just be okay, just fucking. If somebody's shitty to you, like, just brush it off and move on Like. This is the other thing too, with like confidence and mental health and just awareness, like you know, you talk about self-confidence. Part of self-confidence is it's a management thing, right, it's a mental health thing. So you have to manage your mental health, your anxiety, your anger, your things like.
Speaker 1:So the more stuff that is unimportant, that you're giving fucks about, is going to take you down and make you more insecure and you know confidence is about insecurities and managing your insecurities and like. So the more shit you're letting bother you, that shouldn't bother you, that you can just let go. It's okay to let go. It's okay if somebody, like somebody disrespects you that you don't know, or even somebody in your life, it's okay to just like, not say anything and walk away and let it go. You don't have to one-up them, you don't have to get on top of it. You don't know like, blah, blah, like, and if it's continuous, remove it from life. Like. These are the things that allow you to build good relationships with yourself because there's less noise. You need to put yourself in an environment where there's less noise.
Speaker 2:So maybe maybe it's all also like managing your own like expectations going into it, like if you are just okay paying for the date, regardless of what the outcome is or how it is, like that's just one thing you have to remove from the equation while you're on the date too, so like just I'm going to pay for it or, you know, I think that might help too. Like to your point like remove some of that noise and, regardless of the outcome, just be good with that and and what you brought to the table and and walk away if it's not for you to go, like on a second date. So it's good.
Speaker 1:I mean just to go back to that real quick. That guy that was just his ego. Claim that was just his ego he was upset that he got rejected and she, you know she dealt with it the best that she could.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's all good.
Speaker 1:We got to get away from dating.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:So we went down a bit of a rabbit hole, like we always do, but if it's still in confidence yeah, no, I think I think it's good, but I do think that touches on a different subject that we'll go back to maybe in another like episode, which is like what are the rules that we have around dating Cause?
Speaker 2:I think we could like have some fun with that. But going back to the topic that I have, which was like building confidence, and personally I like to sprinkle in some like dating myself. So I think it helps us like build confidence just being out in the world, like whether you're on a date with somebody else or not, like if you can go on your own number one. It opens up the opportunity to like meet people in real life, but also just gets you accustomed to like getting dressed up, getting just like getting out there without the pressure of actually meeting somebody, like if you go on your own, and it helps like build your own confidence. So like that's something I like to do. I haven't done it recently, but it is something I like to do, especially if I'm in like a phase of going on a lot of like first dates. What, what do you think about that? Do you like to go on like dates by yourself?
Speaker 1:I don't typically call them dates, but I like to. I do like the concept of dating yourself. I think even people in relationships should spend time by themselves. I, of course, I do Like I. I choose a lot of times to go, particularly during football season, so I have to go watch the Packer game at.
Speaker 2:Tappenberger by myself and I always meet people Love that that is such a good, by the way, such a good way to meet people.
Speaker 2:Oh my God, like okay, so I have, I have friends that hates online dating and they're like well, how do you meet people in real life? And I'm like get into sports If you're not already like get into sports, like go out and just watch, because if you can go, if you can find a place you're comfortable with and what like, if you're into it or no, just like a smidge about the team or the sport, it's already a common like topic that you can talk about with anybody who's next to you, and I want to clarify too that this is like remove the dating for a second and trying to meet somebody, but like it doesn't just have to be single because like yeah, in our middle age, like I've done this and I've met I've talked about this on a different podcast where I met I met a dude you know like and I'm finding friends like you can be married in a relationship and like say hey, like stay home with the kids, I'm going to go watch the game.
Speaker 1:And if a dude hits on you or a girl hits on you and you're in a relationship, obviously set that boundary, but please. But you'll probably meet friends too, and there's absolutely no shame in it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I've met friends. I've met a ton of, actually a lot of my circle of friends I've like met that way Well, I like it too.
Speaker 1:Just because I again going back to paying for dates, I just feel like, wow, like I'm dating myself, I can spend twice as much, you know. So like I don't fret as much about what I'm ordering and like blah blah. It just feels a little bit more free, and yeah, I do that all the time I. I joined um a cornhole league a few months ago where I was a free agent, they call it and I ended up meeting some really cool people.
Speaker 2:Did you do that in the neighborhood?
Speaker 1:I did it down in Rhino. I always do it in Rhino.
Speaker 2:Okay, there is one in the neighborhood, by the way I don't know if you knew that. Yeah, at the brewery I joined a kickball league here in this neighborhood.
Speaker 1:It was such a yeah at the brewery. I joined a kickball league here in this neighborhood. Oh yeah, there were great people, but they were always struggling for people to show up and stuff. So I try to find the neighborhoods that are more populated. Yeah, and I go to the meetup.
Speaker 2:But see, that's like another great way to just like get out and either date yourself or also I think it's just my reason for bringing that up was like building some level of self-confidence, but like just going out and doing things that you enjoy and like with self-confidence. I think too a good thing to have is like having something you're passionate about, having something you're excited about and hobbies Right. So like what when you're going on on a date? Like having things that you can talk about, but then doing those things on your own or with friends even like helps, I think, build that confidence too yeah, I think I mean I don't, I'm, I'm also like talk.
Speaker 1:We're talking about this at fairly extroverted people, so I don't, I can't get in the mind of an introverted person, but I guess what I would say to them is that you know one. I think there's medication for this now that they make.
Speaker 1:But two like there's yeah they're going to get some backlash on that one, but there is, there's actually medication now they make for introverts to be more extroverted in certain social situations. But there's also like all these meetup groups that are very small. It's like game nights or like on topics, or there's all kinds of industry events too, and even if you are introverted, I mean I run an introverted people all the time at these big events and they're just pulling it together and going and I think again, I'm not introverted. I think for introverted people it's usually the first kind of crossing that line and like finding somebody to talk to at a big event and then going from there. You know, I mean that's even. You know that's even hard for an extroverted person. I don't just walk into a room with a hundred people and be like, feel like the most comfortable person in the world.
Speaker 1:I just like I know that it's okay to go up and just start talking to somebody, and sometimes it's awkward, you know, sometimes the shit that comes out of my mouth just ends up being weird and I can't help it.
Speaker 2:but it's not it's not like rude.
Speaker 1:But yeah, I mean just having the confidence to. Again. This goes back to like nobody cares that much about you and like what you're saying and I'm not saying that in a mean way it's that you know you may make an impression, may memorable, but like none of it's as dramatic as you think and everybody's usually in a place. Most people want to talk and attention, particularly in Colorado If you're a Colorado listener, like my experience in Colorado has always been, people are pretty chill experience in Colorado has always been people are pretty chill.
Speaker 2:So one of the things I think I am building self-confidence. I think if you go into a date having something like you're excited about or something you're passionate about, what like? If you do, you have something like that that you're like really excited about or passionate about right now that you're able to like talk about.
Speaker 1:I mean I get excited about lots of little things. I'm obviously very excited about the podcast. I have been since I started it. I love boating. I mean. One of my greatest passions, though, is which works and works in my favor is I love meeting people.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I love talking to people, like really talking to people, which is probably why I like dating a lot.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm trying to be a little bit mindful of like why I'm dating half the time but I am very, very passionate about meeting people experiencing new cultures.
Speaker 1:But yeah, I mean I can get a lot of joy out of just a backyard barbecue.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So I don't. I'm pretty easy in that regard In terms of like going out and putting myself in situations to meet people. I fucking love patios, I love games. Yeah, Drinking.
Speaker 2:I feel like, weirdly I would say I'm more extroverted than introverted. I would say I'm more extroverted than introverted I can go into a room and, like I feel like it's one of those situations where, like I don't have a stranger, like it would be, it's very easy for me to talk to people. More easy if I'm like in a comfortable situation, like if I know somebody that's hosted the party or whatever, or if I've walked in with someone and so like when you think about. But there's also times that I've found that I'm like, oh God, I don't, I don't want to talk to anybody. Like I get, I can get very sort of intimidated and definitely with like dating, it's easy to like get in your own head and be like, oh, do I look nice or do I, I don't know, like, is this person going to like me or whatever. And so I really like the idea of like dating yourself, going out on my own, finding hobbies, doing things that, like I enjoy. Number one it also like helps meet people in real life. But I think when people engage you in real life too, it helps build confidence that you seem like an interesting person, right, that people are like approaching you and one of the other things I like to do is like I kind of keep this, like I call it a bucket list.
Speaker 2:Like all my friends know that I don't know that it's really a bucket list, but when I first moved here, I kept like a list of things I just wanted to try in Colorado, and I had lived here a couple of years.
Speaker 2:I hadn't done anything on it, and so I finally, like it was around the time my dad died and so instead of a new year's resolution, I decided I was going to do one thing off that list each month, and it was mostly like learning something new, trying something new. It might've been like going to a new ski resort just trying to figure out like I don't know, whatever, try a new hike, go I don't know, just go to a new town in Colorado, just something, trying something new. I think that also helps like meet people, but also like build your own confidence. And then it also helps you like identify like, oh man, I really liked this, I want to do this again. So it helps you like build hobbies and interests, which gives you more things to talk about on a date, and that also helps like with that, like confidence too.
Speaker 2:So I think those are for me, some things I've done to just help build that confidence and like owning my own, my, my own owning alone, owning your shit, just like being comfortable and then being able to come into, like when you, when you are dating, like feeling more confident, right, I mean, I think that isn't that sort of the purpose of these conversations. Is like having owning your own, is like coming into the world like in a more confident way.
Speaker 1:Yeah, of course I think you show up and you'd be yourself.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Unless you're a complete asshole.
Speaker 2:Well, I mean you can show up being yourself and still be an asshole.
Speaker 1:This is true.
Speaker 2:So those things can be, can happen at the same time. But I don't know. I just thought it'd be fun. So what are like? What else can you? I mean, I feel like you're a pretty confident person already, so are there things you do? You talk about Mark Manson, so like?
Speaker 1:it's easy, I know you like to read, like.
Speaker 2:That's something I know like about you, but I don't know if the listeners know like you like to read and I like to learn.
Speaker 1:I like to read. I've you know, I've been an entrepreneur for my whole career, so I have to teach myself things all the time. I like getting out of my comfort zone. I like various perspectives. I like getting other people's perspectives and thinking about it. I'm not super rigid, but I'm rigid where I know well about it. I'm not super rigid, but I'm rigid where I know well. And yeah, I don't. I don't unnecessarily challenge people. I try not to judge people you know and and, but sometimes people, sometimes there is some friction, you know, and there's confidence in that too. To know when, like somebody's again Mark Manson talks about this in models friction. To know when, like somebody's again Mark Manson talks about this in models friction, friction, friction, there's you know you want to identify friction when you're dating.
Speaker 1:Like is she a hardcore Christian and you're an atheist? Is you know, like does she want kids and you don't want kids? Like is she you know Trump supporting conservative and you're a liberal?
Speaker 2:or anything. So he talks about, like identifying friction. Well, he talks about like he talks about getting to.
Speaker 1:There's three different places. You can be, you can be I forget what the actual words he used, but there's basically she likes you, she doesn't like you or you haven't figured it out, and you want to you basically want to ask the questions and figure out. You don't want to be in the gray zone. You want to get to either rejection or acceptance as fast as possible, so that you don't waste fucking time.
Speaker 1:This is the whole quagmire of people that like end up in the friend zones for like fucking years and like love people that don't love them back the same way you're not focused on like these things that could be potentially maybe like a deal breaker don't align and values he's basically like identify values and or or or reject them or accept them, right.
Speaker 2:It's also about like what you want in them. It's not just like them accepting you.
Speaker 1:It's a real brilliant book. The whole premise of the book also is about being yourself putting yourself out there, being vulnerable, not in a sad, insincere way, but just owning your shit Well knowing who you are, knowing what you want, what you're looking for, and at least knowing like what doesn't align right.
Speaker 2:That's what it kind of sounds like.
Speaker 1:Yeah, being yourself, it's not like most dating books are about pickup lines and games and, to be honest with you, if you have to play games with anybody like they're not that's not a good person, which is more about them accepting you than it is about you finding someone that aligns with you.
Speaker 2:Right, like, so, like. If you're both just coming in genuine like in a, in a genuine energy of like finding a good match, then there shouldn't be games, right.
Speaker 1:No, there should never be yeah.
Speaker 2:Like you can just both come in with some curiosity, learning about like one another, and just at the end of the day, it's not like any hard feelings, it's like you're either a match or you're not.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Like, and that's okay, like, so normalizing, sort of that. That's what it sounds like.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, and confidence is confidence is sexy, and confidence like we've we've sort of in anybody so in confidence is about I. Again, I go back to the original comment I made, which is about being principled. You know knowing yourself being principled. You know knowing yourself being principled, being controlled, being aware, having your own thoughts. Yeah, you know being yourself, owning it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I love that. I mean I I think sometimes it's and and that's where I went to like I love having this like bucket list because it's also just like new experiences and helps me like have new hobbies or just like learn something new. It's also just something to talk about or something like my friends know sometimes like what's on my bucket list and then they'll go do it with me, like we'll plan trips around it. Sometimes it's a concert or like somebody I really like, or I want to go to a new city or whatever, and so it's cool because my friends have kind of gotten in on my bucket list and that's that's pretty cool. So sometimes it's just that. But it's also just something to talk about and it's like an intention of trying something new. That that has worked for me.
Speaker 2:But I want to go back for a second Cause. You talked about how you probably like characterize yourself more of like as being like an extrovert, but you also are very much an introvert. So how do you like you're very comfortable talking to people? I think, like I mean, from the first day I met you, it's like always been very easy to talk to you and have like a conversation, which is amazing. That's like such a great quality that you have, but you also need your own time, too right, yeah.
Speaker 2:And so is that something that helps you gain your confidence? Like, talk to me maybe a little bit about like something that helps you gain your confidence. Like, talk to me maybe a little bit about, like what that helps you with.
Speaker 1:Um well, I'm an anxious person, so it helps me with control. Okay, so it helps me so that I can, so I'm not taking too much in and having to process so much at all at one time. It's probably a control thing for me. I like my time alone and then I go out and I recharge through my social, my social you recharge that way, like, and then it almost feels like my social, my, extroverted life is more of how I recharge versus my introverted yeah it's my introverted.
Speaker 1:Life is just for me to regroup, rest, rest, gain perspective, work on the shit you know, like if I was one of those people. We all know, those people that are like extreme extroverts, that don't stop right. Don't stop they just don't ever stop. You know, and I'm in awe of them. I don't know how they do it. They typically have the same, usually in certain types of professions, because they're rallying all the time and those people that's. They just can't. They don't have an introverted side, they don't really like have to recharge.
Speaker 2:I might disagree with you on that. Well, cause, I used to be that person and I think it's a little bit of like running you don't want the calm. Maybe there are people out there that are truly extroverted, like a majority of the time, but for me when I was that way, it was actually like avoiding the calm and like not wanting to sort of think about or have to process some of the things that were happening. It was like avoiding kind of the difficult things that were happening so.
Speaker 1:I mean the irony for me, I have to have that like downtime. Yeah.
Speaker 2:To keep myself from being that like people pleaser, like that's part of my like. That helps me stay like less anxious, less people pleasing. Make sure I'm doing things for the right reasons for myself.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean I also like for me too, like I don't have. Even though I love meeting people and generally getting to know people, I don't like a lot of people. I just don't. I think a lot of people are fucking shitty and I don't people that don't have a grip on their own. There's a lot of people radiating bad energy or just verbally fucking puking, fucking dumb shit and rude stuff and just nonsense in the world, and I, if I was one of those people that was out all the time meeting people left and right in an uncontrolled environment, I would probably get really agitated because I just there are. I'm not going to sit here and tell you I love fucking everybody and every human being's fucking great. They're not.
Speaker 2:That's not well. That's also like not realistic, right? If you were, you'd be I don't know lying to yourself or everybody else, right?
Speaker 1:But yeah, I mean it's, we're getting into a little over an hour but I want to be mindful of time. But like I appreciate the topic, like of confidence, I do think that you know it. It takes like perspective and awareness, like I keep going back.
Speaker 1:We talked about it in the last episode that confidence is all about knowing, it's all about awareness, it's knowing why somebody rejected you or why you feel a certain way. Like you know, like before you, if you don't have good awareness, your insecurities, fucking, they'll melt you away right, like they just take over, they dominate your ego, they play all these fucking tricks on you and at the end of the day, like it, I go back to the you know. Before I had really good grip on my mental health, like how one incident that I didn't even maybe recognize would ruin my day and I don't even know why you know, and that shit doesn't happen anymore.
Speaker 1:It does, but it doesn't it's. I usually have awareness around it and say, okay, I'm going to give you an hour or two, I'm going to give you an hour to just like, debilitate me and make me feel the way you're going to feel, and then I'm going to pull through it and because it's, it's not the end of the world, it's not this like, and eventually the confidence comes along with perspective yeah and giving fucking so many less fucks like well less fucks is good but that, yeah, I mean I think that the ability to give less fucks comes with perspective about the fact that it's not that important right?
Speaker 2:like that those things so you're absolutely right, I think, but I mean perspective and awareness are things that always come up in my like as I'm communicating these things, you know like those are big, important things to have.
Speaker 1:And it goes a long ways. Confidence.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Real confidence and people see it. People with confidence see it.
Speaker 2:Absolutely.
Speaker 1:And then there's ego. People with confidence see it Absolutely. And then there's ego confidence which is false. Like I'm a big you know we've talked about this I'm a big fan of the idea of a vulnerable, which we could probably take more time. I think confidence also has a vulnerable layer too. Being able to be vulnerable is counterintuitive to the word confidence, but it's part of confidence. It's the ability to be yourself. I think it's the root of it actually Like that's.
Speaker 2:That's true confidence is being able to be yourself, even if it doesn't agree or in a vulnerable state, and be able to like, own that Right. I mean, isn't that like the true meaning of confidence, then?
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's good on the spot with that kind of with the tagline yeah, we're going to have to come up with something like you know Jared, jared and Darnana do I?
Speaker 1:I'm obviously like I listened to every one of their things. So I talk about them, but that they solved dating. Maybe we were like made people less alone. I don't know.
Speaker 1:We'll come up with something but, anyway, guys, we appreciate you listening every week. Um, super excited to have emmanuella. Please welcome her. We'll get all of the socials figured out, but you can reach either one of us right now through joel at owning alone podcastcom or at her socials accountability at E. You can find us on the gram. Please reach out, tell us your stories. If you think you'd be a good guest, we'll bring on a guest sometimes or something you want us to talk about. Otherwise we're just going to keep talking about what the fuck we want to talk about. And if you're single and you're out there like fucking and you want to share your grievances of the festivus of dating, please call me and we'll. We'll get you on the love laugh lounge. I've got an opening next week. I want to hear from you. So with that, the sasquatch is out and we don't have a nickname for emmanuel yet, so we'll find. So appreciate you, guys. Bye.
